Galaxy 23


Silver Member
Username: Mucho

Post Number: 415
Registered: Dec-07
Galaxy 23
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Galaxy 23 Spacecraft Design Space Systems/Loral
Orbital location 121° West
Launch Date
Vehicle FS-1300
Design Life 12 years
C-band payload 24 x 36 MHz
Amp type SSPA, 20 watts
Amp Redundancy 16 for 12
Receiver redundancy 4 for 2
Coverage 50 State, Canada, Mexico
Beacon 3700.5 MHz (H)
Beacon 4199.5 MHz (V)
Galaxy 23 is a the name given to the C-band service of the Galaxy 23/EchoStar 9 communications satellite jointly owned by Intelsat and EchoStar located at 121° W longitude, serving the North American market. It was built by Space Systems/Loral, as part of its FS-1300 line. Galaxy 23 was formerly known as Intelsat Americas 13. The "Galaxy 23" portion of the service provides transponders in the C-band. The "EchoStar 9" portion broadcasts Ku-band, and Ka-band transponders.[1]

While the satellite itself is jointly owned through a partnership between Intelsat and Echostar, the Ku-band payload is owned and operated by Echostar for international television programming and local television channels. That service is intended for DISH Network customers using a SuperDish system. The C-band payload is owned and operated by Intelsat. The Ka-band payload is owned and operated by Echostar for as-yet-undisclosed purposes

IEEE C band
The IEEE C band is a portion of the electromagnetic spectrum in the microwave range of frequencies ranging from 4 to 8 GHz.[1].

It was the first frequency band allocated for commercial ground-to-satellite communications. A typical C band satellite uses 3.7--4.2 GHz for downlink, and 5.925--6.425 GHz for uplink. C band is primarily used for open satellite communications, whether for full-time satellite TV networks or raw satellite feeds, although subscription programming also exists. This use contrasts with direct broadcast satellite, which is a completely closed system used to deliver subscription programming to small satellite dishes connected to proprietary receiving equipment.

C band is highly associated with TVRO satellite reception systems, commonly called "big dish" systems since small receiving antennas are not optimal for C-band systems. Typical antenna sizes on C-band capable systems ranges from 7.5 to 12 feet (2.5 to 3.5 meters) on consumer satellite dishes, although larger ones also can be used.

Gold Member
Username: Tapeman

New York City in-HD, NY

Post Number: 2947
Registered: Oct-06
Answer to yor question is yes
Yo can get C-band on 1-meter dish
Many people already got it on 1.2 Meter

Perhaps yo can get us foot prints from Tracksat to confirm it

Until that happens
This is the foot prints for Beam C Sat 121W
About 40 Channels FTA available for any true hobbyist
I do help people how to read foot prints
It's yor time to learn it too
Manual dial to exact freq is required and a C-band LNB
And yo'll be ready to get all non-encrypted available FTA channels


Bronze Member
Username: Tdti1

Post Number: 59
Registered: Mar-05
King what are your readings on your 1.2 meter? I have not read of anyone getting this sat with a 1.2 meter, Galaxy-18 is 2 degrees away, there are also 7.8 fec feeds on this bird that people with 10' dishes are having issues with.

Bronze Member
Username: Tdti1

Post Number: 60
Registered: Mar-05
Ok never mind some guys got a few channels but not many, and 30% quality, only 3/4 fec though, I guess because Satmex is further away.

Gold Member
Username: Tapeman

New York City in-HD, NY

Post Number: 2950
Registered: Oct-06
With my 27 years knowledge of physics and electronics
I help people to understand signal strength and main real reason why some people successful with small dish and others are not
I have no use for these channels
But I take satellite hobby very serious
I provide the real reason why yo able to get C-band on small dish others can't

Yo keep saying fec 3/4 is only one works
What I say depending on the beam yo can manually input fec
SatMex 5 at 116.8°W BEAM C is mostly fec=3/4
Yo should get most TP except for TP 11 and 12 but over all over 50 channels
Yo dial freq straight from Lyngsat and it will work trust me
auto fec doesn't always work on narrow band without manual dial
Also it may not work properly if not aimed to the strongest point of the beam
I do have techniques to maximize signal

If yo don't know how to dial freq or would like to know how to it's a 1 minute process and yo'll roll the channels in seconds

Gold Member
Username: Tapeman

New York City in-HD, NY

Post Number: 2951
Registered: Oct-06
This is how to maximize 30% quality:
In antenna settings pick very exact TP with 30%Q
- I slightly rotate LNB clockwise or counter clockwise from mounted bracket even if it's drived by a motor
- I try to slightly move dish left or right
- I try to move dish slightly up or down
- Step and repeat with a lot of patience

Yo'll notice 30%Q increase to 60% perhaps 70%

SatMex is not far infact it's right the center of the continent

Silver Member
Username: Mucho

Post Number: 418
Registered: Dec-07
Smallest dish for C-band reception?

Since I am physically unable to work on my 10' Orbitron which is 15' in the air, I was thinking of getting a smaller dish, pedistal mounting it, and using my SM-2200 as a receiver for experimenting withe LNB's, etc. What would you consider the minimum diameter dish (West Coast, S.F. Bay Area) that will pull in at least some C-band channels. Doesn't have to be great signal quality, just enough for testing. I remember that Radio Shack used to sell a 5' mesh. Perhaps there are still some of those around.

I think Iceberg does pretty good with a 6', but there are some who can't lock some DVB-S2 stuff with a 7 1/2'. So I guess it depends what your final goals are.
What is wrong with your 10'? Maybe someone here is close to you and could help.
Never hurts to ask.

for tinkering? 4 foot
for reliable reception on 99% of the channels? 6 foot minimum

A BSC621 is pretty good for both analog and digital. Don't even bother with a 4 ft dish for c-band. If you spend the time to dig the hole, do all the installation, just go 6ft right away. It's better for cutting down adjacent satellite interference. A bigger dish, is also better for more signal than a lower noise, higher gain lnb

Gold Member
Username: Tapeman

New York City in-HD, NY

Post Number: 2955
Registered: Oct-06
Look Hawk
I do have a lot of respect for Iceberg
He's a forum admin for so many years at satguys
But when it gets to technical issues frequency and polarity I can't be compared to any forum admin based on my technical background in Physics and Electronics
These people got their hands on more than I do I admit I'm new to satellites
Yo can trust my hardware experience and ability to interpet tech specs as good as original satellite engineers

Most of the doccuments yo obtained are totally outdated
I'll give yo an example from yor above post
"A BSC621 is pretty good for both analog and digital."
That LNB only works on Motorolla 4DTV receivers not for FTA receivers
Also when anyone say digital/analog channels it means they haven't been aware of all newly updated satellites

There is hardly any analog channels left comparing to 5 years ago and by Feb 2009 there won't be one single analog channel in space

Bottom Line
There are hundreds of FTA C-band that can be obtained on a 1.2 Meter yo can either listen to me or listen to Iceberg
I did provide how to pin point which beam is reachable from a scientific prospective

Silver Member
Username: Mucho

Post Number: 420
Registered: Dec-07
I'm using a 6ft solid and I was pulling in some c band, but not enough- 10ft is the way to go.
currently testing
10' Bud + 24" actuator + Moteck Vbox V positioner
Viewsat ultra+pro
Pansat 3500 + SonicviewSV4000
6' HD dish + 18" actuator + Moteck positioner
90cm + moteck 2100
3 other dishes
2 invacom quads:canada

Silver Member
Username: Mucho

Post Number: 421
Registered: Dec-07
C/P I have tried many different sizes from 4' to 16'


So far Sami's & Perfect's 7.5' mesh is the smallest that will give you good results, provided you are using a good quality LNBF. Best one I found so far is ApenEagle V4000. db gain for C band is only 64 and KU is only 56 but actual results are really good.


Who in the fucck is this nut guy called King?

Gold Member
Username: Tapeman

New York City in-HD, NY

Post Number: 2956
Registered: Oct-06
Yo can quote hundreds of users will advice of bigger dish all day long
These people got limited tools and resources
Newer FTA recivers got much more powerful scan tuners
Don't know much about manual freq dial
Don't know much about LNB skew
Not totally updated with recent satellite industry shift

Many broadcasters already turned to smaller dishes for on the road broadcast
Almost more than 50% of exhibits at SATCON C-band last year had smaller C-band dishes on display
Many hotels installed smaller C-band dishes like Hits at 101W and 105W C-band

Things have changed this decade
All broadcasters got more demand to smaller and smaller dishes and I think by end of 2009 there will be by the thousands not by the hundreds from what I see at this rapid growth

Today there over 300 FTA C-band with higher EIRP that's higher density therefore small dish will do, less wave density yo'll need big dish to collect larger cross section and the weaker it gets the larger the dish
Yo are collecting freq beam not optical beam

FTA and 4DTV are 2 different things
Make sure yo know what yo wanna get

Silver Member
Username: Mucho

Post Number: 424
Registered: Dec-07
King Tapeman(Yo can quote hundreds of users will advice of bigger dish all day long)

You got that right, but can you find anyone on any website that can pickup
these channels that you say on C-band
with a 1.2 meter dish. I can't

Gold Member
Username: Tapeman

New York City in-HD, NY

Post Number: 2959
Registered: Oct-06
I'm not forcing anyone to do 1.2M
Based on what I know yo can pick certain beams on a 1.2M
I'm usually few steps ahead of any hobbyist
So until other forum admins pickup what I already advised all my posts are timed and dated
I will post every single beam that can be picked by a 1.2M

Once again
All I'm doing is explain to hobbyists why certain beams can be picked on a small 1.2M dish while others can't
All from a scientific prospective
In science we don't believe in just luck
We do explain the laws of physics

There is always a possibility DN and BEV use unbreakable security and hackers pick on DC II which can only be received on a 1.2 Meter dish
There is always a possibilty
Yo never know what can happen
My hobby won't stop when that happens

"but can you find anyone on any website that can pickup
these channels that you say on C-band"

That's what makes King different from anyone else

Silver Member
Username: Themangod

Post Number: 512
Registered: Oct-06
what i find funny is kind saying it can be done and telling people how to do it yet he says he does not do it

so if you never did it or not doing it now maybe you should allow the others with more know how talk.

sounds like White Hawk is right.

King Tapeman why are you telling people how to do something if you never did it or dont do it?

King Said
I have no use for these channels
But I take satellite hobby very serious

you take satellite hobby serious yet you have no true FTA or big dishes?

The fact is lyngsat satelliteguys all say it cant be done. satellite guys is a dish network advertising partner i trust them over king any day after all hes never done it Ice use to work for the a big dish company.

Bronze Member
Username: Tdti1

Post Number: 61
Registered: Mar-05
First off you will be lucky to get some channels on a 1.2 meter, the very limited channels will all go away once more traffic is added to the neighbouring birds, the laws of physics prevent a smaller dish to be 2 degree compliant, people getting 30 quality are lucky, the 3/4 fec feeds are managing to come in, again they will be lost soon, no way to get a 7/8 fec feed, I showed a friend of mine in the broadcast industry some of your posts he had a good laugh.

I am not sure who has been putting up smaller dishes but with dvb-s2 and fecs like 7/8 I know most company's have been putting up larger dishes.

The 2009 date is for ota only has nothing to do with cable distribution.

Again hook up a spectrum analyser and you will see that the interference from adjacent satellites make reception on a dish that is not 2 degree compliant pretty much impossible or unreliable, it is possible to use a smaller dish on c-band if the birds are spaced out far enough, this is not the case in North America, it can be done in Europe and Asia as some birds are over 5 degrees apart.

Again unless you have managed to change the laws of physics your not going to have much luck at all.

Gold Member
Username: Tapeman

New York City in-HD, NY

Post Number: 2961
Registered: Oct-06
How many time I have to say it
If yo auto scan it depends on the receiver
It could also depend on the LNB rotation to pick a specific polarity
Manual freq dial is the key find exact freq including S/R and FEC
30% Q can be easily improved
Did yo tweek the dish or LNB?

Yo keep saying 7/8
Be specific
What beam are yo refering to?
Yo can be trying to get a beam going to europe and yo going nuts to get
50 FTA channels at 121W all in FEC 3/4
Where do yo get 7/8 from?

Select a specific beam and I'll be glad to analyze it
As far as spectrum analyzer
Fewer channels and smaller s/r will show smaller band peaks that's not the laws of physics that's the laws of electronics

Most pay service use 20,000 s/r to fit more bandwidth per TP and that shows wider bandwidth on spectrum analyzer
They sell these equipment at the show
Yo can see all of that yorself at the SATCON this fall 2008 and ask all the question yo want

Yes I advice many people without trying myself as a matter fact I'm a cable user occasionally I do try it from time to time

I learned few things at the show and I'm passing it on
Yo don't like my advice just do the opposite and yo'll be fine

Look yo wanna challenge me
Pick a specific Satellite
I tell yo what yo can get and what yo can't get
And let's see if I'm right or wrong
The proof is on the roof

Bronze Member
Username: Tdti1

Post Number: 62
Registered: Mar-05
The spectrum will show you the large amount of interference that is not allowing the channel to come in, I already showed the calculations to you, it's all about being 2 degree compliant here in North America 1.2 is not simple as that.

You will not get more than 30 quality no matter what you do, to much interference, 30 quality mite be able to give you a picture for 3/4 fec 7/8 will not work as 30 quality is not allowing enough error correction to pass.

I do not waste my time on smaller dishes, it's pointless, these thing may work in your head however in the real world this is not the case.

Gold Member
Username: Tapeman

New York City in-HD, NY

Post Number: 2963
Registered: Oct-06
I read yor comments yo didn't read mine

FEC 3/4 means bit 3 and 4 of the 8 bit flag
That's a software hex code Code 0C

FEC 7/8 are bits 7&8
That's also software hex code C0

The 8 bit flag is even after decoding to MPEG-2 and before decypting DVB security code if it's not in clear FTA

Spectrum does not show interference
It shows frequency band after down converting to 1G to 2.2G Hz
To optain data yo must decode MPEG-2 or QPSK modulation or newly standard MPEG-4 as 8PSK modulation

Interference is an opposite vector cancellation of frequency
Vectors cuz frequency is an electromagnetic field or wave
Voltage/time is the represented vector on the scope shown as an analog indicator

2 degree is an LNB requirements for 4DTV Motorolla receivers
i.e. is why yo'll see C-band seperated 2 degrees apart
Sat 121W, 123W, 125W, 127W, 129W, 131W, 133W, 135W etc.
I'm talking about FTA C-band not 4DTV paid service
2 different things

2 degree requirement means LNB won't pickup any close by satellite
It applies to larger dish as larger dishes can easily pickup more than one sat LNB can reject higher or lower frequency pitch
Smaller dish yo'll hardly pickup 2 sats with enough strong flux density
If yo do that can weakens auto scan
Yo do manual dial yo control which freq to scan
Auto scan will take any sh!t that goes thru yor tuner
That's why I said modern FTA receiver got better tuners

Silver Member
Username: Dimwitt

Post Number: 786
Registered: Aug-06
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Silver Member
Username: Mucho

Post Number: 425
Registered: Dec-07
You are a very funny man ,now get lost.

You are wasting your time with the King.
You can't reach him. He is not from our planet.

Gold Member
Username: Plymouth

Quebec city, Quebec Canada

Post Number: 2787
Registered: Jan-08
Lol too good

Bronze Member
Username: Tdti1

Post Number: 63
Registered: Mar-05
You obviously have no clue what you are talking about.

Again if you have a signal of lets say 35-40 on a newer model dvb receiver, a signal using 3/4 fec mite come in as there is more error correction for the receiver, now if you did manage to get the same amount of quality on a channel that is using a 7/8 fec you will not have a image, as there is not enough error correction for the receive to make up the picture, you would probably need 65-85 to have a steady picture, and this is not possible using a 1.2 meter reflector.

With the spectrum analyzer you will see the signals from the adjacent birds, if you have some one who can use one and no how to read it this will make sense to most people.

To much interference will block out the feed, it's simple to understand. for most people.

A 2 degree compliant reflector is for C-band use in North America and has nothing to do with DCII, or lnb's, actually 4dtv feeds are easier to pick up than most newer dvb feeds using H.264 DVB-S2 and different fec rates, as 4dtv is mpeg II and most channels are 3/4 fec, this is why many people can get 4dtv channels but can't get many dvb feeds, DCII, power vu whatever the satellite and lnb does not care, there is no difference when trying to use a reflector that is not 2 degree complaint.

You can go on as much as you would like but the laws of physics will never change, or will it change the excessively wide beamwidth of a undersized reflector, the larger the dish the more pin point accuracy you will have, the smaller the dish the more if the sky you see, this is how you can get 5 birds on a 24" dish. you may want to get a dish that meets FCC 29-25 Log q recommending a reflector that is not 2 degree for North America is not a good idea.

I will take proper mathematical calculations and measurements from experts any day rather than posts from a man who thinks he can do something no one else in the world can, a man who claims he can change the laws of physics, keep in mind more channels go up nearly every day, more birds will be stuffed in to any space that's left, so instead of misleading people you may want to recommends a 2 degree complaint reflector or larger, as undersized reflectors will be useless in the not so distant future.

Gold Member
Username: Tapeman

New York City in-HD, NY

Post Number: 2968
Registered: Oct-06
Yeah that's right
I have no clue about FEC
I just learned something new now

Obviously yo are not ready for FTA C-band
When yo do yo know where to find my stuff

I pick topics that are new to hobbyst within satellite industry and usually old fashion school sat users pickup later than new commers

Hundreds of people already picked FTA C-band
I provided answers that no one else did before
When true hobbyst ask those questions yo can eaither advise them with bigger dish or direct them to my detailed step by step easy to follow instructions

I have nothing to respond to yo anymore regarding 2 degree complience cuz that's an LNB and tuner protocol yo seem to get that mixed up. And if someone thinks 7/8 FEC is more forward error correcting is got a lot work to catch up ahead.

Bronze Member
Username: Tdti1

Post Number: 64
Registered: Mar-05
I just hope people do not waste time and money on something that hardly works and will not work soon, they will if they listen to you, I have been using c/ku-band for over 25 years, 90% of what I watch are dvb feeds, I also use 4dtv and have 2 big dishes and a 1.1 meter Patriot, and a few other dishes that I took down, I am friends with people in the broadcast industry and have learned many things from knowledgeable people, so as I go by fact you seem to go by assumption people can be there own judge and if they think about c-band I do hope they will go with a 2 degree complaint reflector.

Silver Member
Username: Mucho

Post Number: 428
Registered: Dec-07
Teddy I wouldn't waste any more time on this phony.

I think that he is only here to
cause trouble to this forum.
He knows nothing about this FTA Hobby.

Silver Member
Username: Gregraf

Post Number: 909
Registered: Dec-07

Gold Member
Username: Tapeman

New York City in-HD, NY

Post Number: 2970
Registered: Oct-06
I don't mean to disrespect yor experience
I did say that earlier

But King will never post wrong technical information
Infact if I say it can be done cuz it is
There is always a possibilty what I say is accurate
And what I'm saying is 100% accurate
Yo wanna believe me that's fine yo don't it's yor freedom of speech
When yor ready to do FTA C-band yo know where to find my stuff
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