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PLASMA PIONEER ELITE: Burn-in after only 2 hours

 

After having used a.o. this extensive thread to make up my mind on Plasma vs LCD, I bought the Pioneer Elite 1130 HD plasma screen for $6,000. I have had it for 4 weeks and was very happy with the picture. HOWEVER,I played a DVD and accidentally left on the menu screen of the DVD for 2 hours. When I cam back and flipped the channel, the menu screen had already burned in into my plasma screen. THIS IS A NIGHTMARE AND I AM APPALLED THAT SUCH AN EXPENSIVE FLATSCREEN HAS THIS PROBLEM AFTER ONLY 2 HOURS OF STATIC SCREEN. DESPITE ALL THE CLAIMS OF THE MANUFATURERS AND SALES PEOPLE TO THE CONTRARY, I CAN NOW PRETTY MUCH THROW MY $6,000 FLATSCREEN AWAY. WHAT A BUMMER!
It seems unbelieveable that the manufacturers can not come up with a screensaver that kicks in after 15 minutes of static use. Ridiculous!!!
 

Silver Member
Username: Cuylar

Burnsville, MN USA

Post Number: 179
Registered: Nov-05
which menu on which movie? a grey screen will let it even out. i doubt very much that you have a full fledged burn-in after just 2 hours. in fact i am going to call that bs. HOWEVER. I have felt your pain on this one before. What you have is called image retention. It WILL go away. put on some full-screen (16x9) video with always changing bright colors. (toy story 2, finding nemo...etc.) if that fails to work after a whole movie i will explain how to make a negative image. There are usually settings on the dvd player that prevent it from going into sleep mode on the menu... this is the DVD player. not the tv. as far as the tv knows it IS a moving picture since the menus have many moving objects.
 

Silver Member
Username: Rysa4

Post Number: 223
Registered: Jul-05
That is after image retention and not burn in. The manufacturers have screen savers called wobblers that do kick in as well. Just leave it off for awhile, it will likely be gone. Burn in cannot happen in 2 hours.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Ncavman

N.C.

Post Number: 92
Registered: Dec-03
"It seems unbelievable that the manufacturers can not come up with a screensaver that kicks in after 15 minutes of static use. Ridiculous!!! "

Wow... the manufacturer should know if you walk off and leave your new plasma TV on. Yeah right, its their fault. Geez. Besides,. that is image retention not burn in as Marc said. Do some homework and in a week you'll be fine.


- New Monster component cables for the plasma: $80
- New stand for the plasma: $250
- Blaming the mfg for your own mistake, while at the same time paying $1000 too much for the TV.....PRICELESS!

.
 

Silver Member
Username: Cuylar

Burnsville, MN USA

Post Number: 191
Registered: Nov-05
wow, I said it first.... lol
 

Bronze Member
Username: Ncavman

N.C.

Post Number: 96
Registered: Dec-03
Yep! You did! You get the gold star.
 

Silver Member
Username: Cuylar

Burnsville, MN USA

Post Number: 199
Registered: Nov-05
woo hoo!! i love whining!
 

Lon
Unregistered guest
Fixing and avoiding burn in.

If you set your plasma up correctly, you should not have many problems with burn in. You should invest in Video Essentials or AVIA disc to do this. Your contrast and brightness is set way too high when you first get the unit. Your contrast should be about 1/3 of what you get it at. The disc will help you set up everything properly. Make sure the set Contrast, Brightness, Tint, Color, and turn the sharpness all the way down. All sharpness does is add noise to your picture. It may take a few days to get use to the way the picture looks now, but it is worth it. The picture will look better, the display will last much longer, and you will reduce you chance of burn in.

If you have a burnt in image try running something on it for 24 hours. Test have shown that this will get rid of most burn in. You have to put it on a channel that has a lot of motion and no logo that may cause more burn in. Most sets will not burn in with just a few hours of a static image. Just keep in mind that you do get what you pay for, but even the cheaper sets look and function much better when you set them up properly.
 

Unregistered guest
Any luck determining if your problem was burn-in or not. I share your frustration. I just got a new 1130HD with an Xbox360 and after about 5 hours of playing, I have burn in all over, from multiple games. I feel sick right now. Help!!!
 

Silver Member
Username: Rysa4

Post Number: 280
Registered: Jul-05
again- burn in is uneven phosphor wear- you CANNOT get true burn in with 5 hours of use on a plasma-only after image retention-which is reversible.
 

New member
Username: Bunnellt

Post Number: 1
Registered: Jan-06
Thanks Marc and thanks Cuylar:

I made the exact same mistake as Peter, with the exact same Tv and for the exact same duration (2 hours). My DVD is set to auto power off after 30 mins of a DVD concluding, but it didnt function.... a bad time for a malfunction given that my pioneer elite pro 1130 had about 10 hours of use. Anyway, the DVD menu that was on screen seems to have disappeared, and is only barely visible now when the screen is totally white. Safe to assume that this is image retention and not burn in, and is thus reversible? It looks like some members on this thread are saying fix it by leaving the TV on and running colorful films with lots of motion, others are saying leave it off. Any suggestions?
 

Silver Member
Username: Cuylar

Burnsville, MN USA

Post Number: 223
Registered: Nov-05
don't use all white. just watch something full screen
 

New member
Username: Bunnellt

Post Number: 2
Registered: Jan-06
Thanks.

If playing colurful fast-paced movies full screen doesn't work, and if the menu is still discernible over a solid white background(another note is that the dvd menu only seems to be visble on white backgrounds for standard def cable channels, not high def or dvd.), what is the negative imaging that you referred to?
 

Silver Member
Username: Rysa4

Post Number: 296
Registered: Jul-05
Many plasmas have a reverso feature, so for instance the blacxk bars would be lighter ( not quite white) and the info more central will be darker. This doesnt mean you want to play something with bars- I mean it plays a negative of the picture so to speak. I have no idea if your plasma has this feature. Otrher plasmas have a wobbler function.

The key to avoiding problems is within the first 100 hours of plasma use for some reason. During that time, you want movies with no bars and with movement and color changes. After awhile, plasmas dont seem very susceptible to burn in and after image rettention as they might be when first used. I have no explanation for this pattern. I have left my plasma on all night by accident and dont have a hint of these problems. Its three years old as far as use as of March 13, 2006.
 

Silver Member
Username: Cuylar

Burnsville, MN USA

Post Number: 224
Registered: Nov-05
You are looking for instant results. Give it 15-20 hours. It'll fade. As far a permanent correction..... wait 100 hours. This isn't a science.
 

New member
Username: Bunnellt

Post Number: 3
Registered: Jan-06
Thanks both. By playing full screen movies and not locking on to any channel for too long in the early phases of use, the image retention has faded. No longer an issue.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Skasol

Post Number: 31
Registered: Mar-05
take the required precautions to prevent burning, and you should be fine, I know sometimes there is image retention, I still experience some of that on my HPR4252, but it goes away after a few hours, this is from playing x360 on it, for hours.
 

New member
Username: Nirradus

CA

Post Number: 1
Registered: Apr-06
Hi,

I've read all the posts here and you guys are pretty friggen mean at other peoples expense. What's worse, you pretend to know what you're talking about and you don't.

Here's the skinny, my little pretties:

I had the exact experience as Mr Peter who started the thread. Although my problem wasn't related to leaving the set on for any given time. We never left images up on screen, used the set for perhaps 2-3 hours a day in the evening and by the end of the first month I was already noticing image retention.

This took the form of everything from the little Spike TV logo in the lower right corner of the screen, to the 4:3 retention. My DirecTV channel guide even retained image. We didn't use the TV enough to justify any of this erratic behavior and the problem seemed to be getting worse.

I called the store where I bought the TV and they had a pioneer tech come out. He took one look at the screen and said I had a messed up monitor and it had burn in all over it.

Now, I called Pioneer and after much pleading got them to agree to have the set brought in for service. Supposedly they were going to shoot lots of white stuff at the TV over the course of a couple of days.

Cut to five days later. The service company, who is an authorized Pioneer service center, said the problem would not go away. When I asked him if I had image retention he said "you have burn in."

A pioneer rep came out to the service center yesterday, took one look at the set and said, I see "burn in" all over this.

Okay smart guys? That's the skinny from the rep.

Now, in all fairness to your high-fallutin attitudes, this could all be semantics. But for your information, my set was one month old before it got BURN IN. And that's not me saying that, it's an authorized service rep and also a pioneer service rep.

That being said, it remains to be seen what they're going to do. The jury is still out. Everyone has agreed that this is an unusual problem for this kind of thing to happen so fast, so I'm hoping they will replace the set, though contractually, from a warranty point of view, they don't have to.

Which brings me to MY point. This smells like a class action law suit. I'm sorry, but just because Pioneer (in this case) decides that they won't cover burn in, doesn't mean it isn't something that shouldn't be covered and maybe a large lawsuit is the only thing that's going to get these guys to stand up and listen.

There is no way I should be reponsible here. What's more, Pioneer, who markets a top of the line product, should stand by that product. That's the bottom line.

Since you folks seem to be somewhat knowledgeable, I was wondering if anybody knew about any class action suits or legal action or anything brewing regarding this issue.

If so, please let me know. A fraternity buddy of mine from back in the college days is a nationally known Class Action Lawyer and I'd like to bring this to his attention. But before I do that I was hoping to gather some more information.
 

Silver Member
Username: Cuylar

Burnsville, MN USA

Post Number: 229
Registered: Nov-05
Lets clear the air here. There are some holes in your story.

Are you going to tell me that you watch 2-3 hours of tv per day?

Do you only watch Spike?

How often do you chanel surf?

Just because someone is "an authorized service rep" doesn't make them know what they are doing. IT ALSO does not mean they are plasma experts. I would bet that the rep you work with doesn't own one. I would also bet that he had a preformed opinion about plasma TVs.

Taking an easy out is what they did. And they have every right to do so. You probably do have burn-in. You can lie to us if you want about whether someone left the set on for too long and that's fine. But in 5 hours.... you cannot have burn-in. it's not possible.
 

New member
Username: Nirradus

CA

Post Number: 2
Registered: Apr-06
Uh, hello?

Where did I ever say in my post that I got burn-in after five hours? Huh?

I said that we watch, on average, 2-3 hours of TV a day and by the end of the first month, I noticed burn-in, or image retention, or whatever.

We channel surf. I can't compare to anybody else, but sure we do. So what? Are you telling me that with a plasma I can't channel surf? I can't watch 4:3?

Are you also suggesting I'm lying? That somehow I left my set on like the guy who started the post? That's not really helping to clear the air any, is it?

Further, I own high end audio equipment and take excellent care of that. I never leave my TV on when I'm not watching it. In fact, if I know I'm going to be away for more than 10 minutes when I'm watching, I usually turn the set off.

True, just because someone is authorized to work on Pioneer sets doesn't make them a plasma expert. But neither does coming on these boards and acting all superior, like most of you folks in this post. I don't see any experts here. I see folks with some knowledge, but what's more clear to me than anything is that nobody really has a complete understanding of these plasmas but a lot of people, like you Cuylar, are more than happy to point out what everyone else doesn't know.

And what exactly would you know about burn-in? Are you an expert? Are you trained in plasmas? Do you build them? What makes you the authority? Who says you can't have burn in after five hours. How it is "not possible"? What are your qualifications to speak on the subject?

Huh?
 

New member
Username: Misterhobbes

Post Number: 1
Registered: Apr-06
Cuyler, you should consider the possibility that just because you've been told that burn in doesn't happen under the conditions described in this forum, that it may happen just the same.
What makes you sure that burn in can't happen after reasonable use, i.e. in less time than you think? You read it on a website? A salesman told you? Because it didn't happen to you?
Those are the three likeliest reasons I can come up with for your unwillingness to believe the original post, but they are all bad reasons, imo.

Nirradus; I have what seems to be burn in after using the set very similarly to how you describe. Any updates in the interim since you last posted?

Regards,

James Baker
 

New member
Username: Nirradus

CA

Post Number: 3
Registered: Apr-06
Pioneer came out to look at the set and they agree it has pretty bad burn in.

The situation is tricky because officially, they won't cover burn-in and they don't want to start because they'll have to replace half their plasmas.

That being said, I'm working directly with the owner of the repair shop, who has a very good relationship with Pioneer and he's trying to get them to replace the plasma for me. The owner of the shop is pretty sure they'll replace it and right now the status of my trouble ticket is 'pending'.

He says the absolute wrong way to deal with Pioneer on this is to be rude, obnoxious, demanding, etc.

It's a shame it has to be done like this, but I just want the set to be replaced, so I'm playing ball.

Short of that, if Pioneer decides they don't want to replace the set, I'll be left no choice but to go to the dealer where I bought it and demand that they replace it. I give them a lot of referral business and I'm sure they don't want to lose me a customer, so that's my ace in the hole. I hope it doesn't come to that.

All I can say is that as far as I'm concerned, these plasmas are still in their beta phase. They clearly don't work properly and the companies won't cover burn in because they'd be replacing them left and right. I still think this is a class action law suit, but who has time for that.

My recommendation would be to work closely with the dealer where you bought the TV and also work with a reputable repair shop that has a good relationship with Pioneer.

It's a pretty sucky situation all around.

More when the verdict comes out...
 

Silver Member
Username: Ncavman

N.C.

Post Number: 124
Registered: Dec-03
Amazing how these new guys show up, act like AV pros, but bi*ch about their gear and their problems, act like an a*s, and end up logging on as another newbie and have discussions with themselves.

Sorry you had trouble with your Pioneer. They have been darn near flawless for everyone I know, including my 2 displays.

Please start your own thread about your lawsuit and issues.
 

New member
Username: Misterhobbes

Post Number: 2
Registered: Apr-06
It is unbelievable to me how personally you guys take it when somebody gets on "your" forum (the nerve of us newbies!) and reports something that is different from what you believe or have experienced. I think you wankers need to start your own forum that has rules about newbies asking questions that don't make sense to you.

Who the heck cares your Pioneer has been flawless? What are you doing on this forum then? Go watch it, or spend time with your greasy friends -- and let those of us who actually have a problem ask legitimate questions without you pencilnecks getting on and acting galled that we just don't understand how impossible our questions sound to you.

I can only assume that you have been marginalized to such a distressing degree in your own life that you have chosen this forum to pose as the alpha male no-one else lets you be.

If I ever get to the point that I haunt a computer forum so possessively that I resent newbies for asking questions and -- gasp -- having discussions with each other, please remind me of my promise to shoot myself.

Nirradus -- good luck with your situation. I believe you. I don't think I'll be back here again. There seems to be a few too many people with their self-esteem wrapped up in their TV sets.

NCAV: keep it up, you are almost up to 150 posts!

 

Silver Member
Username: Ncavman

N.C.

Post Number: 125
Registered: Dec-03
Hi James, and your other personalities:
Way to start out your relationship with this forum. 2 posts that suck. School is in session and you have done no homework. Forgot your medication again?

These forum exist to is to discuss audio and video, not to rile people up into class action lawsuits, piss and moan about your problems, and entertain schizophrenics. If you don't like it here, simply find another place to spend your time.
However, if you wish to stay and discuss audio and video, that's good, we'd LOVE to have (one of) you.
Warmest regards and happy listening/viewing.
 

New member
Username: Nirradus

CA

Post Number: 4
Registered: Apr-06
You know, I gotta agre with James here. You people come off like a bunch of pr*cks.

I mean, ncav, who cares if your set works. I've had problems with mine and so have others. All very similar problems.

Cuylar, there's a real gem. I went through this thread and looked at all this persons "discussion". And it's all, this is impossible, and that can't happen and you're a liar if you say this, and your service guy is an idiot that. Okay. And then we ask this Cuylar, "hey, what makes you such an authority on plasmas."

That's when we hear the sounds of silence.

As for you ncav, you talk about how this place is forum for discussing audio and video, but if you look back at the early part of this thread, you and your cohorts were so quick to ridicule Peter Van P.

And you were so proud of your little quips.

Get real and face it. There hasn't been one person to come on this thread with any definitive information on burn in. Just your preconceived notions about what is and what isn't.

Whatever.
 

New member
Username: Tweatherford

Post Number: 1
Registered: May-06
i got two pioneer elist plasma's 42". They are awesome but when the TV isn't in full screen mode it has black or grey lines on the side. When it is in HD mode it still shows the faint of those lines sometimes whe the picture is a high contrast. I been trying to keep it in full screen wide mode to keep the lines off but so it doesn't get worse but didn't know if there was something I could do to try and get these lines off? I have about 100 hours on one of the TV's and maybe 50-60 on other one. Both show the lines. Any suggestions would be great.
 

New member
Username: Kwakaklee

Hong KongHong Kong

Post Number: 1
Registered: May-06
Hi guys,

I hope I don't get slaughtered the same way others have in this forum but wanted to put my experiences in also. I'm on to my second PDP-436PG Plasma after the first one was replaced by Pioneer Hong Kong and I have the same image-retention/burn-in problem others have talked about.

I'd classify my family as 'normal' TV watchers with a few hours in the evening and a few more on the weekend. Here in Hong Kong all stations have their logo on the top left/right of the screen and for a couple of channels, the logo doesn't move at any time, even during commercials. Consequently, our most watched channel (Star World) has made an almost permanent mark on the top right of the screen.

After speaking with Pioneer the first time this happened, they said the set was more susceptible to 'burn-in' (their words) in the first 1000 hours of use. I complained that it would have been nice to put that in their manual as the sales guy said "these six generation plasma's don't suffer from burn-in at all" -- obviously he was mistaken!

Pioneer came out, upgraded the sets software that was supposed to increase the refresh rate or something and told me to leave a colourful, 16:9 DVD running similar to what others have mentioned in this forum. I did this but after 48 hours there was little improvement. Subsequent 'strong' conversations and Pioneer obliged by 'burning-in' a new set for me and setting the contrast, brightness, etc. to what they believed was the best method of preventing image retention or burn-in. They did cover their butts by stating that the problem may still come back but I was willing to take their advice as Pioneer claim to be No.1 in plasma's! Another interesting point that came up was that the same set has a 5-year guarantee in Australia (not covering burn-in) and they haven't had a single case bought against them apparently. They don't even bother with the software upgrade as it's not required there.

Got the new plasma, watch TV as normal for a couple of weeks and guess what came back?!? I told Pioneer what was happening but it was just to much hassle to persist with really. To combat the situation I now leave Ice Age or something playing over and over when I go to bed and by the morning the logos have faded. I can only hope that after 1000 or so hours the set won't suffer from this problem but after spending all this cash on a plasma TV, I'm nothing but disappointed. I wouldn't recommend this or any plasma to anyone. Spend the extra cash, get an LCD and forget about it!

On the plus side it does stop my wife watching too much "Bold & the Beautiful" as it's aired on Star World!
 

New member
Username: Edawg13

Post Number: 1
Registered: Jun-06
i would like to add my 2 cents worth. I have two plasma screens. The pioneer elite 1130 and the Panasonic 37 inch. The panny is 5 months old and never shows image retention nor burn in, my Elite is now a little over a month old and has image retention or burn in all over it. In fact, I just put a DVD on the other day and after 30 seconds of the menu being on it already held the DVD menu image. I have the same viewing habits on both tv's, however it is almost impossible to watch any normal channels or sport without something consisently on the screen. That being said, I have not left any of those images on for more than two hours at a time and in most cases, less than an hour. Very disappointed with the Pioneers ability to handle image retention, whereas the panny rarely shows any. Elite has the best picture on the market, now its time to see how Customer Service is, with their so called in home two year warranty. Please keep people up to date regarding possible class action suit, This is unacceptable for a $5000 tv!
 

New member
Username: Sbama

Post Number: 1
Registered: Jun-06
After doing some searching, it looks as if my problem is not rare. I have had my 50" Pioneer Elite for 2 months. After a 5-6 hour video game session, I was sick to my stomach when I shut the game off and found what I thought was burn in. After calling the place I bought it from, they told me alot of what I saw on this thread...play an animated movie and it will fade. Well, it is slowly fading. I have played the movie over and over. I can still see faint signs of it on white screens. I had used the tv for the 100 hours they told me to, but this still happened. Is this going to happen in two years? I thought I had done the research and from what I heard, the first 100 hours were the critical time. Now I am paranoid about it. The salesman also told me that he would come out to my house and fix it if the animated movie didn't do the trick. I haven't called yet as each day seems to get better. Does anyone know what Pioneer reccomends regarding this? How long is my TV in danger of this happening??? Thanks for any thoughts or info.
 

New member
Username: Edawg13

Post Number: 2
Registered: Jun-06
A quick follow up to my last post. I played finding nemo once through in full screen and it washed out my image retention, however the image retention I had was from very few hours of the same imgage and in some cases, only five minutes of a DVD menu which was really puzzling me. I assume the longer the image sets there the harder it is to wash out and in some cases completely burnt in. I would never play video games on a plasma screen. If you are a big video game player I highly recommend LCD or a microdisplay rear projection. I will post more feedback as I watch my Plasma more and see if this method of washing out really works or it the image comes back. So far, I am a little relieved but still disappointed that I could get image retention from such little use.
 

New member
Username: Fre00ie

Post Number: 1
Registered: Jun-06
Hi, I just broke my Pioneer PDP-614MX plasma screen. If anyone have any idea to fix or replacing the screen, pls let me know.
 

New member
Username: Jayl1982

Post Number: 1
Registered: Jun-06
Hi, I bought a Pioneer Plasma PDP-436RXE and after just 5 days I see some image retention/burn in from playing Need For Speed Underground I now have the right speedomeeter now I can see a faint circlular meeter on any light image displayed. I sent a really pissed email to Pioneer Europe as I live in Cyprus and I received a phone call from the Manager of the Distributing office in Cyprus and he said that unfortunately within the first 200-300 hours Pioneer Plasma T.V's are very sensitive and susceptible to image retention. He suggested to plat the movie Ice Age over and over again until it disappears it has been 4 days now of playing the movie twice a day so 8x1.5 hours so about 12 hours in total and still the image retention is still there. I'm wondering how long will it take for the image retention to disappear or am I just wasting my time and is the Pioneer tech guy just screwing me around. He also said not to worry the image retention will disappear but is just a matter of time. I'm pissed because I did not think buying a T.V for $4,000 could possibly end up with Image retention I thought they have made ways to prevent this. If anyone can let me know if I'm wasting my time or if I should continue to play Ice Age as I'm so sick of this movie
 

Bronze Member
Username: Skasol

Post Number: 42
Registered: Mar-05
Did you calibrate the TV? (AVIA), also you shouldn't play any games on it for the first weeks.
 

New member
Username: Jayl1982

Post Number: 2
Registered: Jun-06
Hello,

Yes I realize this now but when I bought the T.V nobody told me not to play any games on it. But the tech guy I spoke to said that if I keep playing Ice Age on high contrast the ghosting will dissapear is this true?
 

New member
Username: Mrbig

New York, Ny Usa

Post Number: 6
Registered: Oct-05
Thanks for all your warm and understanding feedback on my reported problem of burn-in. It is now 6 months later and I am happy to let everyone know that most of you were right and that the problem turned out to be image retention rather than burn-in. It still freaked me out though. Right now the picture is very clear and the HD channels are truly stunning.
I am glad the Pioneer lives up to its very high expectations.

Thanks again for all your feedback.
 

Silver Member
Username: Blazer

Post Number: 102
Registered: Feb-04
Hello Peter,
I've been following your thread for a while now and just wanted to let you know that your PE is as good as it gets in plasma technology today. Panasonic has it's fans (Consumer Reports) but can't hold a candle over all to the your PE. I've been researching burn-in for alomst a year now and it is almost a moot point now for top brands like PE unless you do something totally stupid like go on vacation for a week or two and leave your plasma turned on in 4:3 mode. Other than that, it's all image retention and can be corrected quite easily. Best of luck and congrats on spending the extra bucks on a truly awsome tv.
 

New member
Username: Nirradus

CA

Post Number: 5
Registered: Apr-06
Hello all,

Wanted to let you know the conclusion of my burn in problem. After having Pioneer agree to let the set go to a service center, the problem was not fixed.

I complained (nicely) to Pioneer and finally got them to agree to take a look at the set itself. They were intrigued by the fact that I had multiple kinds of image retention/burn in and wanted to have a look.

They took the TV for two weeks and blasted it with all kinds of signals. Aging the TV, they called it.

Anyway, it worked and took out all visible burn in.

I asked the engineer I was working with -- this is a Plasma specialist working for Pioneer -- I asked him about the difference between burn in, image retention, etc. He said it was all the same thing.

Regarding Blazer post: "burin-in...is almost a moot point for top brands."

That's simply not true according to the Pioneer engineer. It does happen but can be corrected most of the time.

Still, I get image retention when I'm watching sports, but now it's the kind that goes away after awhile.

I believe this is the just the way it right now with these tv's and until something comes out better I still believe the PE is the best plasma on the market and get hours of enjoyment out of it.

Out

Nirradus
 

Silver Member
Username: Rysa4

Post Number: 522
Registered: Jul-05
Glad it worked out for you, but some corrections; Burn in by definition is permanent. It cant be "blasted out." Pioneer plasmas are excellent, but each plasma brand and resolution has its advantages and disadvantages. There is no one best plasma. An ED will be best for 480 signal. A true 1080P will be best for true 1920x 1080 signal, and a 1024 plasma will be best with what satellite and cbles companies call HD signal. Some are better in the dark, some better in ambient light. ( contrast level effect).

So--if anyone says " This is the best plasma..." it really means they think its the best based on their source and environment-- or they just dont know.
 

New member
Username: Count_gothic

Post Number: 2
Registered: Jul-06
As I read through all these comments as to which is best Plasma or LCD. It occurs to me that LCD is better for general purpose ie regular TV programmes, gaming, watching DVD's. Whereas it seems Plasma is best served as for watching just DVD's. Mainly because of the "screen burn" issue LCD's would be better for just everything. But the home cinema fan would opt for Plasma.. have I hit the nail on the head?
 

Silver Member
Username: Cuylar

Burnsville, MN USA

Post Number: 231
Registered: Nov-05
no
 

New member
Username: Pmathieu

Worcester, Ma USA

Post Number: 1
Registered: Jul-06
To those of you with thoughts of litigation against Pioneer for defective Elite Plasmas, check out the latest Class action suit against them in the July/August issue of Sound & Vision Mag page 73 to see if you have one of the included sets.
 

New member
Username: Sirron

VALLEY CENTER, CA United States

Post Number: 1
Registered: Jul-06
I paid $5000 a month ago for my Pioneer Elite 1130. I just saw one advertised for $2100 plus shipping. I sold the useless speakers for $20. I'm reading about all this "burn in" and am a bit worried. I'll keep watching this site. Ron.
 

New member
Username: Sirron

VALLEY CENTER, CA United States

Post Number: 2
Registered: Jul-06
Pioneer Elite Pro 1130 HD (50 inch) -Plasma Flatscreen - $2,100.00 - Vendio

Via a Google search.
 

New member
Username: Profhd1

Manassas, VA USA

Post Number: 1
Registered: Jul-06
I just bought the 50 inch PRO-FHD1 1080p plasma. Picture is ridiculous! However after watching 4:3 shows for a couple of days I too have a thin clear line on the left and right sides when watching a 16:9 show. Is this the image retention or butn in? I will get a pic posted later Please help thanks.
 

New member
Username: Brostami

Post Number: 1
Registered: Jul-06
Has anyone done business with Vendio???? Its kind of odd that the rest of the world's prices are in the range of 4-7K and they are offering it at $2100!!! I wrote to them, they say they are buying high volume from Japan with 3 year US warranty and they also offer paying through ESCROW.com with 3 day inspection period!!! Should I trust this buyer and go for it??? I need to buy a 50 inch very soon since my Panasonic 63 inch projection TV (Only 6 years old, paid 3K for it back then) is loosing its picture and I do not want to spend money fixing it. I would appreciate any feedback.

Thanks...
 

New member
Username: Pmathieu

Worcester, Ma USA

Post Number: 2
Registered: Jul-06
I have been trying to do business with these people for two days. They are looking for a money gram (ya right) or they claim to have an account with escrow.com. To do business with escrow.com, and use a credit card (the only sane way to do business) you have to use their "premier service" and in this case the cost is $134.44 for this transaction amt. Vendio is an auction house. They claim they will ship for $21.34 3 day select UPS. I can't ship a laptop to Fla for that! Be very careful that the transaction actually goes through escrow.com, and not some scam "affilliate" or you will find out why the 1130 is only $2100. I am still persueing this and will post updates.
 

New member
Username: Pmathieu

Worcester, Ma USA

Post Number: 3
Registered: Jul-06
As a follow up to my previous posting, The Vendio deal never happened. Initially when I tried to buy the 1130, they urged me to send them a money gram for the full amount so that I could get a quick delivery. To use a credit card (for protection) I would have to go through escrow.com, and wait much longer. When I went to escrow.com and registered, I read their page on all the scam sites that tried to mimic the real escrow.com. I then challenged the dealer as to whether they were actul members of the real escrow.com and they broke off the transaction with no further response. No money lost!
 

New member
Username: Brostami

Post Number: 2
Registered: Jul-06
Thank you so much Paul for sharing your experience with the rest of this board. It did sound too good to be true, but it was definitely worth pursuing. I wonder if there is a way to report these kind of online scams to FBI or some other authority. Thanks again.
 

New member
Username: Husker_dave

Post Number: 1
Registered: Aug-06
I have the 50 inch 1130HD plasma. Picture is sweet! I have a thin clear line on the left and right sides when watching a 16:9 show. Is this the image retention or butn in? I have noticed over time the line is blending in more while watching programs in the wide screen mode. Light picture screen you can notice the line more, will these lines ever go away?

I called Best Buy where I got the TV from in Feb, they sent out a tech rep, he noticed the lines and stated there not burn in but retention? How long does retention last in these sets?
 

New member
Username: Pmathieu

Worcester, Ma USA

Post Number: 4
Registered: Jul-06
Another update on the $2100 1130HD Plasma. Although I have not made this purchase a reality, I am not convinced it is totally a "scam" site. Maybe a "Bait & Switch", but I am still looking into it and do not plan to lose any money on it. Definitely a very small operation with limited products if legitimate, and with the wording of the correspondence, not your "born in the USA" nationality. (not that their is anything wrong with that). Will post again.
 

New member
Username: Misterhobbes

Post Number: 3
Registered: Apr-06
I am only vaguely re-assured by those who are killing themselves over the distinction between "burn in" and "image retention". Based on my own experience, I will acknowledge that I may have experienced "image retention" and not "burn in", as long as you define the latter as something that *never* goes away, and the former as something that *eventually* goes away. This was of little comfort to me while I waited for three months for my 4:3 bars to fade to the point of being largely un-noticable. What is more, I have had to adopt an un-relenting campaign of vigilance in order to achieve these results. Who the hell wants to check on their kids or guests to make sure they aren't allowing the grey bars to show on your plasma screen?!
Not me!
I think that the truth needs recognition that plasma technology is flawed at this point in its evolution. Those who lack the initiative to be neurotic about what is displayed on their sets WILL likely suffer ghosted images. Frankly, I for one don't care that it's "not permanent". For my intents and purposes, it IS permanent if I let the stations switch back and forth without warning -- which many of them do! -- between widescreen and 4:3 formats. And forget about using the plasma for video games. I would roughly estimate that every 4-6 hours of sinful use of your plasma for video games will require a week or so of penance in the form of vigilant widescreen or repetitive "Finding Nemo" to correct the problem.
"Not Permanent" ! Thanks a bunch, says I. Try going on a first date with a festering crop of impetigo on your lip and see how far "it's not permanent" gets you.
"What the heck are those vertical lines on your brand new TV?" says my brother. "Oh," I respond, "that's just image retention. It's NOT BURN IN!".

I'll keep my Plasma screen, but my next purchase will be an LCD.

--James
 

New member
Username: Kwakaklee

Hong KongHong Kong

Post Number: 2
Registered: May-06
Strong words there James but I hear you loud and clear and back you 100%. I've been watching my plasma on ZOOM mode for over 6 months now and you can STILL see one particular stations logo on light backgrounds. Nothing upsets me more. LCD's cost about the same price, sometimes cheaper now so I've recommended to all my mates that they bypass the plasma.
Strangely enough, the next generation Pioneer plasma's have come out and now that dealers are being honest with me they have told me it still has the same problem. Simple solution, stay away from Plasma's!
 

New member
Username: Misterhobbes

Post Number: 4
Registered: Apr-06
yes sorry about strong words. in social settings, my wife is my apologist. I was kind of laughing as I wrote that. I certainly wasn't meaning to give offence. It is true however that a problem is a problem, regardless of the explanation that underlies it.
I'm glad the ghost images fade over time, but it bothers me having to baby the set so I don't worsen it or cause the problem to recur.

--James
 

New member
Username: Pmathieu

Worcester, Ma USA

Post Number: 5
Registered: Jul-06
One more follow up to the $2100 elite pro 1130. This is a major scam. Once you place your order and say you want to use Escrow.com for credit card protection, you will get an email back with a web address to go to "to read the terms of Escrow.com" You are then told to download the security agreement. At this point, a virus is downloaded to your PC that will disable you from ever getting to the real Escrow.com. You will always be forwarded to the fake site, which looks identical to the real site, except that it is not a secure site. Once you enter all your personal info, they have it, including your password to the real site. When a product is advertised for less than it's mfg cost, beware. Also, if a dealer is not an authorized Pioneer dealer, do not expect to collect off the warranty. Ouch!
 

New member
Username: Skydive

Post Number: 1
Registered: Aug-06
I've been following this post as I just purchased a Panasonic 50PX60U a little less than 30 days ago. I went with the sales person and an article I read which stated "the newer plasma screens are not suceptable to burn-in." BULL#@!* I already have image retention and had to play Jscreenfix for two full nights to get the image faded (but not gone). Must I say to myself "well, i've played this videogame for 1 hour now, time to turn my $3000 TV off so I dont ruin it" Paying this much for a TV I should be able to do whatever I want with it and not have to worry about watching a certain station or playing a videogame for too long. That's what I bought the dang thing for, to waste hours on end staring at it, whether it be 1 station with a logo in the corner, or the same video game for 8 hours straight.
Face it, Plasma technology just doesnt allow you to do that. I'll be returning my plasma this weekend and replacing it with an LCD that I wont have to babysit.
I'll let you guys know when my LCD is ruined from burn-in. ha.
 

New member
Username: Misterhobbes

Post Number: 5
Registered: Apr-06
Dereck: I share your indignance. Those (salespeople, for example) who cleverly promise freedom from "burn-in" are clearly obfuscating by their technical distinction between "burn-in" and "image retention".
I mean, explain to me like I'm in Kindergarten: why is it OK my $4000 TV is showing stuff that's not supposed to be there? Why do I have to run a DVD with whitescreen on it to make it go away?
I am not so much annoyed that the technology is flawed, but rather that the industry is marketing it as though the problem has been rectified. I genuinely would have gone for an LCD, had I known about this problem.
And the fact that the warranty excludes "burn-in" is pure charlatanism. It's a bit like a car warranty that excludes engine failure.

Plasma: Ptooey!

--JEB
 

New member
Username: Texan125

Post Number: 1
Registered: Aug-06
I have an older Pioneer 50" PDP 502 MX Plasma Monitor, I have had it for 5 or 6 years. It was used as a monitor for a little while before I got it. It has had some spots from the beginning that look like burn-in and now on light blue screens it is fairly pink. Would any of the above suggestions help?
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