my system consist of Maranzt 5400 Nad C320BEE Wharfedale Diamond 9.1 RCA QED silver spiral 1M Cable QED Silver Anniversery Bi-Wiring 3M
I listen mostly to slow jazz like stacey kent stuff, my listening volumn would not go beyond 9 oclock.
The mid is solid, clear and realistic, the bass I would complaint a bit too strong or on the warmer side but its good when I listen to pop music, ok the problem I'm encountering is the high, its not bright and its harsh, whenever you find the singer sing an "S" its really harsh and most time I've to leave the tone defeat off as I need to compensate the treble to 3oclock.
Anyone having the same set up would like to share your opinion? Do you think its the 320BEE problem or is it the wharfedale thats just isn't bright? BTW I wish I've found this forum b4 I go bought all the stuff. This is a forum full of information thumbs up!
Get rid of that Silver Anniversary speaker cable mate, it (over) pronounces the treble BIGTIME. A nice thick copper cable should sort your system out and also give it a bit more bass to boot! I must say also, I know it's quite pricey but your interconnect is famed for being a bit sibilant too (those S'ssss you mention) - again I'd recommend swapping it out. I take it you live in the UK? If you can afford to drop £40 Richer Sounds do the Cambridge Audio Studio Reference interconnect and it is superb - warm sounding and full of bass. I don't often recommend RS these days but I'd walk miles for that interconnect. Basically, change your speaker cables as that's the cheapest and most necessary fix, then - if you can afford to, ditch that treble-ridden interconnect.
Sun King, I saw this original post at lunch today and wanted to say exactly what you are saying but I figured another NAD devotee would do it I would let them take the heat, LOL. I agree with Sun King entirely about the speaker cable (at least about which one to drop). Just to compare though before buying spendy copper I would buy cheap stuff. Try the Home Depot outdoor extension cord (the one with the black and orange cover). Good luck.
nout
Unregistered guest
Posted on
With all respect, but I consider room acoustics in this case more important than replacing speaker cables and interconnects. Michael Lee is complaining about Harsh Treble, there is no subtlety in his description so he isn't served by subtle treatments: changing cables and interconnects. You cannot get rid of harsh treble simply by changing some cable.
I recommend you to experiment with speaker positions and see if it will improve anything, use furniture (maybe replacing) in this experiment for clothed rooms (is this proper English?) can tame aggressive treble. Play music in a concrete room without curtains and furniture and it will sound dead cold and aggressive.
I understand your point nout but unless he is living in an untreated glass house I don't believe that room treatment will do it. Room treatment is certainly the most underrated part of a system. In this case though I really believe it is the cables or system synergy. To switch to some cheap cables just for research purposes would be cheap and may yield some good info.
I tried like you guys suggested, I took my old copper cables and tried it on the speaker, the SSS is still there but the clarity the tiny bits seem missing I think I prefer the QED its more detail especially when most time I played rather medium low volumn.
Could it be the amp or the speaker? any of you having the same set up?
Not the amp unless something is wrong with it. Probably synergy not a good match of components. What's the weak link. Probably the CD player. Mix and match, see if you can audition different pieces at home. Perhaps borrow from friends overnight. Also as nout suggested if you have alot hard surfaces in the room do something to soften it. I have not heard that particular Wharfedale so I cannot comment on it specifically.
Try experimenting with acoustics treatment - with as many pillows as you have. Place them behind the speakers, and in the space between them. Experiment in different locations, and see if you like what you are hearing.
If yes, you can google search for making your own acoustic treatments for not much mullah.
In fact, we should all treat our rooms if we want to enjoy good sounds at home. We shouldn't mega bucks in upgrades 'til we have done so.
What I don't understand is this: If Michael is turning the treble control to the 3 o'clock position, then he's increasing the treble output a lot. It's almost as if the treble output of the Diamonds is very low.
Michael, have you taken off the connecting biwirejumpers on the Warfedales? You should have. If so, disconnect the speaker wire from the low frequency part of the speaker and play some music. Do you get a sound out of the treble units? If not, there is a problem with the speakers!
If this is not the problem, I would be more inclined to wonder about the Marantz. The NAD is not a dull sounding amp usually.
I'm sorry to confuse the matter, overall the sound is on the warmer side so I need to increase the treble... I'm refering to the quality or smoothness of the high, its a little inaccurate especially the SSSS maybe I think its the best diamond 9.1 has to offer. I'm being a little mean here paying so little and expecting too much.
For the price I've no right to complain I paid for the whole thing including the speaker stand with sandfill for USD1215. As usual we always like to find fault so we can upgrade a little something.
nout
Unregistered guest
Posted on
I still don't understand:
Is your treble "Harsh" or not? Do you mean that the overall treble performance isn't detailed except the upper highs, which are too much?
Marantz cd players in general have an extended treble performance in comparison with NAD for instance. A lack of detail in this department isn't likely to be the cd players fault, and the harsh upper-treble as you describe (ssss with vocals) you will find with similair priced cd players, with some recordings.
I own a Marantz cd 5000, which treble performance sounded rough at times, but I found out that the NAD's, Arcams and Rotels I tried didn't perform any better in the upper-treble department. A rough recording will sound crap on any budget cd player I'm afraid.
For me switching to another amp (in this case a Marantz PM 7200) did the trick, no more SSSS But I cannot blame your amp, which is fine, so I'm puzzled...
Have you tried, as I suggested earlier, to replace your speakers?
It's too warm now? I was under the impression your system was too bright! In that case Nad is a warm amp builder so you need to change your amp. The treble is rolled-off and can be a bit sibilant but the overall sound is one of warmth. Kef speakers tend to brightness but are perfectly matched with Nad amplification - so change your amp or your speakers. Don't do either without a demonstration though!
I am having trouble following here as well. Why should the treble be at 3 o'clock? Maybe it is the recording quality of the CD's you are using. I have owned the 320BEE with the Wharfedales and never had this problem. However, I use a NAD CD 542 and have always loved the treble especially after getting rid of the AXIOMS I used to own. I am a little surprised since the Wharfedale uses a dome tweeter that is not known for SSSS sounds compared to metallic ones such as aluminum.
HHmmmmmmmmm!
nout
Unregistered guest
Posted on
I know what he means: he likes his treble detailed, with a lot of presence, yet smooth and refined. With his current set-up he has to crank up the treble on his amp to get the presence he likes, but at the cost of refinement.
It looks like NAD's tone controls distort the signal. Buy another amp?
yes exactly nout ... I was having trouble describing the problem. I've to take a loan from my sister she has the mission 754 I think quite sometime back have to see how it perform with my set up.
nout
Unregistered guest
Posted on
No actually you did a good description (the quality or smoothness of the highs) I just didn't read properly the first time.
Trying your sister's speakers might be a good idea, don't buy anything new before you tried things out...so ignore my words "buy another amp?"
I just only had my sistem for 10 days and already so many things I'm unsatisfy , perhaps I'm the type that listen to sound instead of music, gotta learn to stick back to listening music.
B4 going to seperates I was planning to buy the nakamichi soundspace 9 I know it sounded so down below when comparing to hifi but at least I cannot upgrade lol.
Try burning them in - new gears need time to burn in - you can leave the music playing when you go out (pretty loud) - if your neighbors don't mind.
Also it takes time for our brain to get used to a new sound - see if you can come to like it before upgrading already.
If I were to upgrade, I would use the computer as the source - many are going this rout - computer makes a good sounding and convenient source, with the right setup.
Upgrade the soundcard to waveterminal u24 ($160 ebay), and add a DAC if you want even better sound.