Alpine vs Infinity
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Bronze Member Username: Shawn_4B-Town, Texas Post Number: 55 Registered: Aug-05 | Ok heres my situation. I have been looking everywhere and talking to evryone about a new system. I am always changing my mind on the subs. The setup i want is 1 RE XXX 15 but i cant afford that right now. I also would like 2 RE SX 12s or SE 12s but cant afford those either. I have been impressed with the Soundsplinter Rl-p15 but for the price i can get either 2 Alpine Type Rs or 2 Infinity Kappa Perfect 12.1ds. So i am wondering which would sound the best and i guess i want more spl than sq but i still want good sq. I am thinkin about the Perfects in a bandpass because ive heard its more boomy but not good for sq but i like bandpass. Any opinions? |
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Bronze Member Username: MrmbqPortland, OR USA Post Number: 27 Registered: Aug-05 | I would push you towards 2 Infinity Kappa Perfects in a sealed enclosure. What are you going to do about amps, front speakers, alternator, wiring upgrades and a head unit?? You keep on talking about subs and nothing else (as far as I've seen). |
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Bronze Member Username: Shawn_4B-Town, Texas Post Number: 56 Registered: Aug-05 | Alright well i have a Pioneer Deh-p3600 head unit. Its not the best looking but it puts out 2 volts in the pre amp outputs and has tons of settings. Any comments on my cd player? And i own a 98 Ford F-150, so i have 6 by 8s. I have 4 new Pioneer 6 by 8 door speakers that put out 150 watts per speaker ( but they are running of of the cd player so there not getting near the power they need). I dont know what amp to get until i figure out which sub(s) im gettin. But right now i have a RF 4 guage amp kit. |
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Bronze Member Username: MrmbqPortland, OR USA Post Number: 28 Registered: Aug-05 | If you get 2 Alpines or 2 Infinities you are going to need at least 800 rms, plus an amp for the 6 x 8 speakers. If you plan on listening to your system loud, I would definetly look into an HO alternator w/ ground upgades and an alt. to battery pos. wire upgrade. If you don't your battery, alternator and amplifiers wont last plus your system will perform much better...so it's well worth the investment. Using 1/0 guage to the distribution block then 4 guage to your amps is how you want to power your system. That 4 guage kit will not do the job. |
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Bronze Member Username: Shawn_4B-Town, Texas Post Number: 57 Registered: Aug-05 | Ok. How much would just upgrading the Alt. cost? And why would the amps not last as long? What if i just got tweeters instead of an amp for my speakers? |
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Bronze Member Username: John8x12Post Number: 78 Registered: Aug-05 | I wouldn't upgrade the alternator. Look at buying a capacitor or a batcap. Much cheaper. Tweeters instead of an amp will not help because you still need the amp to push the tweeters. |
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Bronze Member Username: Shawn_4B-Town, Texas Post Number: 59 Registered: Aug-05 | Ok thanks. Ya ill start lookin for an amp that will be good enough for the speakers. |
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Silver Member Username: Zero43Kyle, TX USA Post Number: 147 Registered: May-05 | Dont listen to bennett just adding ONLY a cap will make it harder on your alternator and battery I think a HO alternator for you would be between 125-200 depending on who you get it from and no more than $100. I got a 225 amp alternator for about 280+ installation. If you only get the sub amp for now you could probably do without the alternator and get an inexpensive low esr cap. you can probably do without the speaker amp most pioneers ive heard can do well enough(as expected from them) without amplification. You will need at least 100 amps above what your truck will need to do basic functions. I would say take between 1\2 and 2\3 of what your stock amp rating is and add 100 to it and get that size alternator. A cap will only seem to remedy things but until your electrical system can support the load being put on it the cap doesnt serve its true purpose and neither will adding extra batteries. Also I would try not to invest too much in wires as far as brand names go and to add on top the above post 0-2 guage wire is acceptable from battery to Dblock Dont add the tweeters without an amp you will overheat you HU Are you installing this yourself |
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Bronze Member Username: John8x12Post Number: 81 Registered: Aug-05 | You know, I'm not going to get into an arguement with someone that obviously doesn't eh...nevermind. Shawn, do what you want. But I have 3,900 watts going to my speakers and I have a stock alternator. I've had ZERO problems. If you want to spend more money on an alternator then it's your money. Go for it. It's not needed though. |
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Bronze Member Username: John8x12Post Number: 82 Registered: Aug-05 | Oh, and I was running 4 Infinity Kappa Perfect 12"'s with a Solid Audio Amp 1,500 watt. Battery and alternator was stock. Lights would dim when the bass hit. Added one capacitor then everything ran fine. 1,500 watt amp for subs plus a 900 watt amp for mids and highs. Stock battery. Stock alternator. |
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Silver Member Username: Zero43Kyle, TX USA Post Number: 149 Registered: May-05 | Ford alternators are cheap.. heres one on ebay for 185 including shipping it should be more or just what you should need at 200 amps. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/FORD-TRUCK-EXPLORER-200-AMP-HIGH-OUTPUT-ALTERNATO R-7768_W0QQitemZ7993474945QQcategoryZ33573QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem |
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Bronze Member Username: MrmbqPortland, OR USA Post Number: 29 Registered: Aug-05 | Just because the lights no longer dimmed doesn't mean that the problem is gone. The electrical problem is still there, the cap just masked the problem. A HO alternator is the only REAL fix for the problem. Shawn, read through some old threads on caps and look at what Glasswolf says about this and/or look at www.wickedcases.com and look at the capacitor section. He explains it rather well...or much better that John Bennett. |
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Bronze Member Username: MrmbqPortland, OR USA Post Number: 30 Registered: Aug-05 | ^^much better than Jonn Bennett |
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Silver Member Username: Zero43Kyle, TX USA Post Number: 150 Registered: May-05 | Go ahead finish what you have to say next you will have 3 or 4 others with more knowledge about car audion than both of us combined come over an pwned you for saying caps with will fix electrical problems actually you can do a forum search and find it yourself. And you know what a batcap will cost just as much if not more than an alternator for his truck not only that but it would also be much better for his the life of his truck howover long it might be. here i will help you out https://www.ecoustics.com/electronics/forum/car-audio/140848.html heres two this one is a little more informative https://www.ecoustics.com/electronics/forum/car-audio/103576.html and heres three with glaswolfs two cents in it https://www.ecoustics.com/electronics/forum/car-audio/4509.html Funny I dont need to argue I will let others do it for me read those three threads and you will learn a few things. Also with an Ho alternator you will have plenty of headroom for expansion. Anyway just take it one step at a time Whats your price limit for subs. Id go with infinity btw except for one model they are mainly sq subs you could probably get an eclipse or two Just hang around in the forum for a couple days and look at older threads to find the info you need |
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Bronze Member Username: John8x12Post Number: 83 Registered: Aug-05 | I'm not trying to explain anything. I'm just saying he does NOT need an alternator. Depending on the amps he picks, he may need batcaps. Which is still cheaper. My system now is 8 Infinity Kappa Perfect 12"'s. Two Solid Audio 1,500 watts pushing them. Four 5x7 Kappa door speakers, two 6.5 Kappa speakers, and two tweets. Mids and highs are being pushed by a 900 watt Solid Audio amp. 3,900 watt total. Stock alternator. Using a yellow top battery. STOCK STOCK alternator. Used for daily use and winning comps.   |
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Silver Member Username: Zero43Kyle, TX USA Post Number: 151 Registered: May-05 | thanks for the back up M.M. LMAO! |
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Silver Member Username: Zero43Kyle, TX USA Post Number: 152 Registered: May-05 | You buy two batcaps and you have already exceeded the price f an alternator plus install how is that cheaper. yellow tops arent cheap either BTW. I want to point something out but I will leave it alone no sense filling this thread with useless (but funny) comments |
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Bronze Member Username: John8x12Post Number: 84 Registered: Aug-05 | I agree. We also obvioiusly have seperate views. The yellow top was not needed though. That was a personal choice. The same goes with a new alternator. If you add the alternator plus install, it will get expensive. Batcaps I use as a general term. I don't use batcaps. I use Odyssey. One Odyssey battery is way cheaper than an alternator, and it would be all he needs. If you disagree then you must work in the alternator industry and need people to fork out extra money they don't need so you can put food on the table! <----That was supposed to be the useless (but funny) comment. |
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Bronze Member Username: John8x12Post Number: 86 Registered: Aug-05 | And for the record since you are trying to make me look stupid...I'm not a fan of caps. HOWEVER Odyssey batteries are the new technology, and they are cheaper than a new alternator. I'll enjoy sitting back and watch people try to prove me wrong. I doubt many will try though. |
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Anonymous | that explains 150db with eight 12's no different then 300watts louder then setups with 1000 watts nice box by the way |
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Bronze Member Username: John8x12Post Number: 87 Registered: Aug-05 | Yeah, I may build a ported box for the next competition. But that will take up a lot of room. Plus, the bass sounds so crisp now it brings a tear to my eye. I'd hate to kill that just to try to break a record. Thanks though. Question. Ideas on how many db's would add if the box ^ there was ported. My experience I thought maybe 2 or 3 db's. Someone in one of these threads said up to 6 db's. I'd just like to hear opinions. |
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Bronze Member Username: MrmbqPortland, OR USA Post Number: 31 Registered: Aug-05 | John, You can justify the price of 8 Kappa Perfects + the amps and not the 200-300 dollars for a nice alternator?? On top of that you like the sound of Bose?? Explain. I like your choice in subs. Do they all share the same air space?? I have found that they perform better w/o sharing air. |
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Bronze Member Username: MrmbqPortland, OR USA Post Number: 32 Registered: Aug-05 | Box looks cool too. |
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Gold Member Username: Jonathan_fGA USA Post Number: 4440 Registered: May-04 | "Odyssey batteries are the new technology, and they are cheaper than a new alternator. I'll enjoy sitting back and watch people try to prove me wrong. I doubt many will try though." They have a good rate of charge & discharge, but a battery still isn't going to replace an alternator. It doesn't mean jack squat when the car is running as a voltage bias is applied to it, and as long as a bias is applied, no power will come from the battery as it is in a charge state, current will pull from the point of least resistance. Anytime you are not applying the bias, all the system will do is drain the battery down. Not good for the charging system, your car's electronics, or your amplifiers. |
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Silver Member Username: Zero43Kyle, TX USA Post Number: 153 Registered: May-05 | I really cant believe this arguement is still going. Bennet didnt you not say you werent going to argue or try to explain anything. Alterjnator installtion on a ford is not that expensive and can be done on your own if you have guidedance. I know when i was younger all my dad owned were fords they are cheap to work on. Have you ever taken into consideration that most of the drivel the companies say when speaking highly of their products is just marketing. Now stop stealing this guys thread I would also like to mention that you will eventually have you replace those batteries\caps the dont last forever. Alternators last much longer |
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Anonymous | alternators are a constant source.. they never find themselves drained to 11 volts. you can suck the alternators amps dry but then you feed off anything that isnt a constant source and that begins to lower volts which need charged after every bite. |
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Bronze Member Username: John8x12Post Number: 88 Registered: Aug-05 | ron, I'm not trying to argue or explain anything. I don't understand how you seem to get all excited by typing my name in a thread. It's almost scary. You're keeping it going. After stepping back, taking a breath, and not trying to defend my answer, I'll halfway have to agree with the new alternator. BUT How's he going to listen to his music? Always at high volume, then yes, he'll need a new alternator. I''ve priced them for myself--about $450. Not needed for me because the only time I crank my system to the max is during comps--or other short bursts. Now, if he only will have his system cranked up for a few minutes at a time, then the Odyssey battery is the way to go. You're saying it will eventually need replaced? Of course, but it's service life is 3 to 8 years. I've never had the same system for longer than 1 year. And when I sell my system, I sell all of it and start fresh. I don't like Bose. I said they sound decent (or something like that). I have a friend with a Nissian Titan and stock Bose system. He's a country boy and listens to nothing but country. The Bose is all he'll ever need. Mike, each speaker is in its own sealed enclosure. |
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Bronze Member Username: BrynmPrince Albert, SK Canada Post Number: 78 Registered: Jul-05 | John, not to to get too far into this but your system would probably push even higher with an alt. upgrade. take a digital multimeter put it on DC volts and check your power when you have the system turned up. even with a batcap or whatever you are likely sagging below 12 volts. With a properly sized alt. it will keep that above 13 volts, resulting in a higher output |
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Bronze Member Username: John8x12Post Number: 92 Registered: Aug-05 | I know. I'm actually selling the system soon. My next system I will do the alt. upgrade. Ron was pretty much right with what he said, but Shawn said he couldn't afford much. Hench my alternative. Which I will still say would work for him. |
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Silver Member Username: Zero43Kyle, TX USA Post Number: 160 Registered: May-05 | There are cheaper alternators for under $200 i did give him a link for it but... John given the type of non comp audio ethusiasts that hang around this thread you know they will try and show of their system blaring it down the road all the time. hell i used to do that and it got old because I live in south central texas the only subs most people know about down here are the ones easily stolen... basically they consider audiobahn, power acoustik and fosgate as the best subs ever... but yeah anyay being the loudest gets old. Shawn i think you should shop around a little more for subs check out other car audio forums for people selling them. Justin is selling his 12 SX for $180 now i think look into that and I think glasswolf is selling an eclipse but it might be out of your price range. In my opinion its better to do it right the first time insteading of upgrading constantly. The only exception to that I feel would be for subs |
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Bronze Member Username: John8x12Post Number: 94 Registered: Aug-05 | Problem is...each upgrade I do I think it's done right. The one I have now works great, but I want to break Oklahomo's SPL record. I'd love to compete down in south Texas; but at $2.50 for a gallon of gas, it's just not worth it anymore. Not even for the big event in Houston in July. After my next upgrade I'm going to be in the trap of having a bad a s s SPL system, but then I'll be missing my bad a s s SQ system. I guess it's a viciouis never ending cycle. Anyway, 03 Ford Expedition. 4.6 V8. You know of a good alternator cheaper than $450? I was thinking going with Ohio Generator's then I would never have another power problem. That route just gets expensive. |
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Anonymous | i found a 200amp alternator for a 02 expedition 4.6l for 220$ dont know if that will fit or not. or have it custom built for same amp same price. |
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