denon 1804 (90 watts per, on screen display, digital ex - $313 new) vs onkyo txsr600 ( 85 watts per, on screen display, dig ex, learn remote $269 refurb -$394 new) or txsr700 ( 100 watts per, on screen dis, learn remote $499 open box maybe $450 )vs kenwood 6070 or 7070 (thx,learn remote NO on screen $450 for 6070 or $325 7070) I have box set infinity hts 20 sat speakers with 15p powered sub. Any adice is appreciated.

The Denon (according to the online manual) can also drive 2 ohm loads. The Onkyos show 3 ohms

The Onkyo 600 is good but the 601 is much better, though more expensive. 192KHz DACs for the front channels over the Denon, 2 VCR Tape loops - the 600 had only 1 and wider bandwidth Component Video than the Denon.

I have two Denons, an 1801 and an 1803 because at the time the Onkyo 600 didn't have two VCR loops. But, if I were looking for and receiver today in that price range - I would be buying and Onkyo TXSR601.

Hope this helps.

Thanks Derek. I was just hoping for the on screen contols and the 601 for some reason doesn't have it. ( even though its predesesor did 600) Being new to this I do not really understand the tape loops or the khz dacs? Is the 1804 not worth it because of this? How are your denons? Also any input on my speakers. Infinity hts20 sat speaker system w/ 150watt powered sub? Thanks again


I was shocked by your claim, based upon what you saw in the owners manual, that the Denon 1804 would drive 4 ohm or even 2 ohm speaker loads. This would be a real change for Denon. So, went to the on-line owner's manual where I looked up the spec page in the 1804 owner's manual (p.65). There, I saw their dynamic power rating for both 4 and 2 ohm loads. Wow? Can this be true? This caused me to explore this issue a little further.

Interestingly enough, the back of the 1804 specifies a 6 ohm-16 ohm speaker. If you connect both A and B speakers and run them simultaneously, they specify a 12-16 ohm speakers (yea, right! Who makes a 12 ohm speaker these days?). Now I am really curious! This is not consistant with the spec page. So I look a little farther and find a warning on p.18 that says the protection circuit may well be activated and the power shut off if the impedence of the connected speakers are less than 4 ohms. Well, that throws out the 2 ohm claim at the very least and many 4 ohm speakers, too, as their impedence will actually drop below 4 ohms at one or more frequencies.

Frankly, this looks like marketing b.s.--just like their power ratings (where they never rate the receiver will all channels driven simultaneously, just two at a time). The spec page must be based upon a simple power into a 4 ohm resistor or even a 2 ohm resistor, but would not represent a real world speaker load. It is pretty clear that a 4 ohm speaker load driven at a high volume would probably trip the protection circuitry--not what you want when you are in the middle of a DVD with a lot of action.

Based upon previous experience, I would only trust what is printed on the back of the receiver because that is what tech support and the warranty will be good for. Stick to 6 ohm speakers or higher to be safe.

Yeah, this is messy.

I am going to take 3-10 ohm resisters (3.3 ohms total) to the local BrandSmart and see what happens.

If the protection circuit switches on (especially with no music) that would be a pretty slick detection circuit.

What we realy need is an objective, instrumented review...

I'll report back.

Cool idea! Looking forward to your report.

OK. I soldered 3-10 watt 10 ohm resisters together (verified as 3.3 ohms with a DVM) to BrandSmart last night and connected it to the 1804 and turned it on. The protection circuit didn't trip. I played some video from what sounded to me like more than one watt - still no protection. That's a good sign except I did the same thing on the Onkyo 601 with no problems either.

It must require something close to clipping or steady state music to trip these things up. I wasn't in the mood to buy two receivers but I would be confident running 4 ohm speakers with either of them even though I was only driving 1 channel. I'll wait for someone with better test equipment to do a more thourough revew.
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