Do I need a sub

 

New member
Username: Pgee

South Carolina USA

Post Number: 8
Registered: Mar-08
Hi, been lurking around for a few months...Room is 25 x 36, but home theater will be less than half of the space

Mainly will listen to music (cds and Dvds) but plan on getting into more DVD movies and kids are getting a Wii for Christmas..

Will buy B & W 684s and 685s with a B & W center HTM 62, the guy at the B & W dealer is not pushing a sub at all (even though I can afford one). I just need to know if I should invest the $800 or so for a sub if the 684s can do it alone..
I've posted my sub choices in another forum

Probably will buy a Marantz SR 5003...

What do you think?
 

Gold Member
Username: Frank_abela

Berkshire UK

Post Number: 3284
Registered: Sep-04
Paul,

Far better to spend the extra on the 683s. I find them to be quite superior to the 684s thanks to their fabulous midrange driver.

I am assuming that the B&Ws are the only option. Although I've just described the better speaker in glowing terms I am not a big fan of the 68x series because of its overblown bass presentation. That said, if that's the presentation you like then enjoy!

I don't know the Marantz at all.

The Wii is only a 2-channel device as far as I know so if you play it through the main system (as I do) all you get is Dolby Prologic and to be honest it's not exactly what the Wii is about. Incidentally, the Wii Sports is still enjoyable occasionally after 18 months, I suggest you get extra controllers, one with Wii Play since that's fun and Wii Fit is an absolute blast!
 

New member
Username: Pgee

South Carolina USA

Post Number: 9
Registered: Mar-08
So then in your suggestion I would not need a sub?
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 11034
Registered: Dec-04
With the 683's, no.
 

Gold Member
Username: Frank_abela

Berkshire UK

Post Number: 3289
Registered: Sep-04
Actually, it depends a bit on what you're after. The sub will improve the absolute bottom end reproduced by your system (whether 684s or 683s). However, I find that the B&Ws are so warm that a lot of the sub's output is not necessarily of any benefit since it gets swamped.

But that's just me. Others will tell you it's nice to have...
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 13076
Registered: May-04
.

Have you asked the dealer why they do not suggest a subwoofer with this system?
 

New member
Username: Pgee

South Carolina USA

Post Number: 10
Registered: Mar-08
I didn't say he didn't suggest one, they sell B/W and Energy...but he wasn't you just have to have one..

For 5.1 I will need one, but now I'm thinking a 10 in. will do instead of some larger one....
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 11036
Registered: Dec-04
I would suggest getting the speakers run in, then focus on room treatments and speaker placement before deciding on a sub.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Pgee

South Carolina USA

Post Number: 11
Registered: Mar-08
That's a plan, but need to strongly consider buying all of the gear at once so I can "manipulate" the invoices (pay some in cash wife doesn't know about) so I can still go over my total budget.

Adding a sub later might be harder to get pass the finance dept (also known as wife)....

It is a good idea though I would be missing the total 5.1 experience until I bought the sub, correct?
 

Silver Member
Username: Soundgame

Richmond Hill Toronto ..., Ontario Canada

Post Number: 249
Registered: Jun-08
For HT it would be optimal to get a sub as you will be missing the sub-bass experience and on DVD/Blu-ray there is a defined audio channel for the sub i.e. the .1 in 5.1. The thing to consider is getting a sub that reaches a fair bit lower than your tower - that's when you will notice the real difference but in any case for HT and action movies, IMO, you can't ever have too much bass from a sub.
 

Gold Member
Username: Dmitchell

Ottawa, Ontario Canada

Post Number: 1650
Registered: Feb-07
I'm with George on this one. If you're going to be watching movies, it's a lot more fun with a sub.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nickelbut10

Post Number: 2056
Registered: Jun-07
I agree, if you want surround sound, a sub is a must.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 13077
Registered: May-04
.

"I didn't say he didn't suggest one, they sell B/W and Energy...but he wasn't you just have to have one.. "

Then it's possible he assumes you want one and isn't making an issue of the sub until the rest of the system is nailed down. Possibly the dealer believes the topic of subwoofers has already been sufficiently addressed.

So, to your question, "Do I ... ?", no, no one needs a sub. But from what you've outlined as your system choices and your personal desires, you would probably like to have one before your wife finds out you bought one.

Don't make arbitrary decisions about the size of the driver. Pay attention to how the subwoofer sounds and its performane in areas you consider essential to your satisfaction. If you haven't decided what these qualities are or don't understand how to audition various subs for those qualities, bring the subject up with your dealer and I'll bet they have some subs in mind for you.


.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Pgee

South Carolina USA

Post Number: 12
Registered: Mar-08
Thanks for the observations, and I think you are right about deciding about the main/surrounds first, which we have not done (well, I know what I am buying, but he does not)... You make very good points...

I think I'm going with the SV PB 12 nsd ($599)...hoping for something like free shipping or the $100 off they are offering on other subs....Would like to get into the $800 sub area, but I can't go that far over budget.....
 

New member
Username: The_mofo

Post Number: 2
Registered: Oct-08
No.}
 

Silver Member
Username: Magfan

USA

Post Number: 361
Registered: Oct-07
Paul, once you have the room ironed out, and even though the listening area is small, the room itself is large, maybe 7200ft3, even with only an 8ft ceiling, you may want to consider a pair of lesser subs. For a grand you can get a pair of subs, locate them asymetrically and excite room modes in such a way that peaks / nulls of one sub 'cancel' the other and produce reasonably flat response over a larger listening area.
Don't try this with cheap subs, though. Another approach would be a sub located fairly close to the listening position which would help mitigate room problems.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Pgee

South Carolina USA

Post Number: 13
Registered: Mar-08
Thanks,
I can touch the drop ceiling (I am 6 ft 2) so that makes it a bit smaller...

Good suggestions, though
 

Bronze Member
Username: Pgee

South Carolina USA

Post Number: 14
Registered: Mar-08
So I've got a chance to maybe pick up a SVS PC Ultra 12" Cylinder Sub- 3 years old- from a local seller.

Would it be too much of a good thing? I can hope to grab it for $500 which is less than half of original asking price..

What do you think? Too big, overkill bass? I'm not a bass fanatic, but do want to set up my HT with great equipment that will last

Thanks
 

Gold Member
Username: Gavdawg

Albany, New York

Post Number: 1242
Registered: Nov-06
Art and I don't care for the SVS subs at all, we both found the bass to be overblown and not particularly flat.

Personally, I feel that the MartinLogan Dynamo is a better sub for around $500-$600. It doesn't have the "wow" factor that the SVS subs have in terms of ultimate loudness, but IMHO is more musical.

Art has had a few different subs as well (ERA and REL, and the MartinLogan and SVS too if I remember correctly).

We just feel that there are better options.

There ARE people that feel they are excellent and are reference quality (especially the high end designs)...just not the two of us.

About a year or so ago, art inquired about the compact cube-ish subwoofer. He said that the response they gave back to him left him with some doubts about the musicality of the designs of other SVS subs as well.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 11063
Registered: Dec-04
Never heard the music from SVS subs...
but hardly hear the music fom my Velo dps12 either...
 

Gold Member
Username: Dmitchell

Ottawa, Ontario Canada

Post Number: 1684
Registered: Feb-07
Ain't nothing musical about the DPS12. It does slap me upside the head, though.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Rick_r

Tucson, AZ USA

Post Number: 57
Registered: Mar-08
Not to throw a wrench in the plan - but I was heading down the multi-channel path a while back thinking I needed at least a 2.1 system and was thinking of a 5.1 system and ended up in stereo. Like you describe, I was more interested in the performance of the audio system, but wanted to be able to enjoy HT with the same system.

If you are really more interested in the music....

- There's not much in the way of multi-channel source material out there (SACD, DVD-A, etc).
- You'll be able to spend more on the individual components in a stereo setup than you will in a 2.1, 5.1, or 7.1 setup.
- It's questionable whether the sub's going to be a plus in your audio setup.
- Unless you're looking for the rumble kind of thing you get from a sub, a stereo tower setup with a decent bottom end is going to cover most of the bang/boom you can enjoy in most movies and is going to cover all the bottom in audio source material.

It might be worth listening to some DVD movies and CDs through a good stereo setup (perhaps at about the same system price point as the 5.1 setup your considering) and compare it to what you are considering just to see if there is a tradeoff here that might interest you.

If you still like the 5.1 more, at least you made an informed decision.
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