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Record clamps

 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1703
Registered: Nov-05
I'm looking at a J A Michell record clamp on ebay. I've read what they are supposed do, but does anyone here use a clamp and are the benfits worthwhile especially on an player like the Xpression 11 rather then much higher end gear?


Also, could they help reduce the 'hum'?

Thanks M. R.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 11727
Registered: May-04
.

No help on the hum by way of a clamp. Clamps and weights do two essential functions. The first is to make a more intimate contact between the disc and platter/mat. The second is to minimize warps. I suspect the Michell clamp does OK at the first task but I'm not so sure how well it performs the second. You really need a table with a dedicated screw type clamp or vacuum hold down to effectively deal with warps. My conclusion would be it won't hurt the table and will probably provide some benefits. You might also look at a reflex clamp which can sometimes be more effective with warps though typically more expensive. The SOTA clamp has always provided good results.


.
 

Silver Member
Username: Malco49

Baltimore, Maryland Usa

Post Number: 131
Registered: May-05
i use a michell record clamp.in conjunction with my TT(pro-ject debut 111,and the pro-ject speed box(the basic $120 model)i feel it has improved sound quality.
the record clamp just seems to be an intuitive improvement,it just seems to make sense that if the record is "clamped" to the TT in a tighter manner it would help the sound.for $60 i feel better for using it.
it does take a bit of "fine tuning" but once you understand how to use it i think it is worth the money.
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1704
Registered: Nov-05
Thanks a lot Jan and MWF

The SOTA clamp is way above my comfort (and my wife's) level pricewise for a clamp. The Michell clamp is around $80AU here and on Ebay about $54AU landed. The blurb about the Michell clamp indicates its use for warping and anti resonance. I know, blurb is blurb. I shall think about this.

http://www.needledoctor.com/JA-Michell-Record-Clamp?sc=9
 

Gold Member
Username: Frank_abela

Berkshire UK

Post Number: 2514
Registered: Sep-04
I use a Michell Orbe with the screw-in type Michell clamp. I used to use a Michell Gyro with the friction type clamp that you can buy on its own. There is no doubt in my mind that the Gyro and Orbe sound loads better with their respective clamps than without.

However - my experience with clamps in other decks is less successful. Sometimes I find that the clamps kill the sound. For example, as an improvement on my Gyro I was given a beautiful gorgeously made SME clamp. It killed the music in this application. The SME clamp is an over-engineered high mass clamp. The Gyro clamp is a very lightweight low mass clamp. They work in different ways and give different results.

I've noted that record decks designed for use with clamps tend to have hard surface platters - Michell, Clearaudio, AVID, Oracle, SME. Those that are not designed for use with clamps use felt mats - Linn, Rega, Pro-ject's lower decks (Pro-jects RPM range use clamps with hard surfaced platters I believe). It seems to me that if you try to use a clamp with a felt mat deck, this kind of defeats the point of the clamp, which is in part to couple the record to the platter. Heavy clamps are meant to sink the energy coursing through the record. Light clamps are meant to transfer the energy through tot he bearing. It's all a question of who you talk to.

So all I can say is, if you go down this route, be prepared to have to experiment a bit. For example, if the clamp does some nice things and some not so nice things on a mat-based deck, then try replacing the mat with a harder surface so the record can couple to the platter better.

Regards,
Frank.
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1716
Registered: Nov-05
Oh great Frank - now that I've already paid and ordered. LOL!

Thanks for the advice. The Xpression does have a a thin felt mat over an alloy platter. So experiment I shall - if the need arises.

All I can say that if the music sounds this good with this table and cart I can only image how the high end decks must sound. And imagine, I think, is all I'll ever be doing.
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 5622
Registered: Feb-05
Both Stu and I had that clamp and had good outcomes from it, however the Herbies Mat provided better outcomes, only without the clamp ofcourse.
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1719
Registered: Nov-05
I can't win Art. LOL! I can only but try the clamp - if I don't think it's worth it I should be able to recoup my money seeing how it's quite expensive to buy here. As for Herbies Mat - I'll wait for the clamp results. I had one of his cd mats and returned it as I felt it had no benefit back then. I realise vinyl is a different beast.
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 5624
Registered: Feb-05
Actually, I'm not sure if Stu had the clamp, I know he had the mat...I don't know....I'm losin' it...LOL!
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1721
Registered: Nov-05
Art - it is a worry. My father is losing his mind (well lost most of it) and his mother lost hers also. And I think I'm losing . . .



er, what am I losing again?
 

New member
Username: Zoney99

Post Number: 5
Registered: Nov-07
Record clamps...........my old AR didn't have a clamp, my old Dual didn't have one, had a Technics direct drive back in day when that was popular, no, dint have one. Have a MMF-5 that has a screw on clamp/felt mat and I like it. Would I buy one just to have one? No.

Audio magic hocus pocus - the "high end" is full of it. How about put on a record and concentrate on having a little fun with your friends and let it go at that? Cheap and effective.
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 5625
Registered: Feb-05
I'm not sure how using a clamp would reduce anyones fun unless you find using it burdensome, I didn't. I have a Rega P5 and no I don't use a clamp...but there can be a considerable benefit to using one...and I wouldn't have to give up the fun to use it.
 

Gold Member
Username: Frank_abela

Berkshire UK

Post Number: 2521
Registered: Sep-04
John,

As I said in my first post, some decks sound appreciably better with a clamp than without. As far as I'm concerned, the Michells don't sound particularly good without the clamp. When using the clamp, the music gains focus, depth and grip (haha).

It's not hocus pocus - it's how to use the tool.

Regards,
Frank.
 

New member
Username: Zoney99

Post Number: 6
Registered: Nov-07
It's a tool and since my MMF-5 comes with a clamp I use it. Would I drop another $50 for a Mitchell clamp? Yeah, if money was burning a hole in my pocket. "I recently added a J A Mitchell clamp to my Project deck and it instantly opened up the full audio spectrum from 20 to 20 khz and the soundstage was fab-u-lous!" ROFLMAO. Hey you want one, it's cool, you have the cash, it doesn't hurt anything = go for it! And have some fun because vinyl does rule, sorta.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 11743
Registered: May-04
.


Personally, I buy the best clamp I can and hope there's a good turntable beneath it. A turntable?! Eh! A turntable's easy. A clamp is one tough sucker to design well.
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Irvington, New York USA

Post Number: 2246
Registered: May-05
"Actually, I'm not sure if Stu had the clamp, I know he had the mat...I don't know....I'm losin' it...LOL!"

I don't have a clamp. I've been contemplating one, but haven't really looked into them. Which clamp were you using Art?

As far as losing your mind... Welcome to the club. I've been on the road for about a week and a half. Three day soccer road trip from DC to Virginia, directly to the CBE basketball tournament in at Mizzou, then directly to the soccer conference playoffs in Dayton. Did not pass go nor collect $200 in between.

Back home for a little while anyway. Now to get the new speaker cables project underway.
 

Silver Member
Username: Stryvn

Post Number: 553
Registered: Dec-06
6moons, Stu?
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Irvington, New York USA

Post Number: 2247
Registered: May-05
Canare 4s11. Not that much of a project per se. More like dressing them up with some Techflex, shrink tubing, and fancy connectors. Mrs Stu just went out for a work related function, so I've got some time to kill.
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Irvington, New York USA

Post Number: 2248
Registered: May-05
BTW, my runs are too long for the magnet wire and yardmaster stuff. Approx 30 ft on each side. That's due to architecture, not WAF. WAF has no bearing in my listening room due to a great agreement with MRS Stu when we moved in. I got the finished attic/loft, and she got the rest of the house. She can't decorate in the attic, but may consult if I can't make up my mind. The same goes for the rest of the house. No picking out curtain for me!!!
 

Bronze Member
Username: Mekongdelta69

Grew up in Brooklyn an...

Post Number: 91
Registered: Apr-07
"I got the finished attic/loft, and she got the rest of the house. She can't decorate in the attic, but may consult if I can't make up my mind. The same goes for the rest of the house. No picking out curtain for me!!!"

>> That sounds exactly like my situation, right down to her getting me some curtains for the two windows (except I have the entire basement -- which I described in long-ago post).

Needless to say, those curtains are in a bag in the garage, destined never to see the light of day again...

Mike_____

.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 11750
Registered: May-04
.


MB - Did you ever build the Zigmahornets?
 

Bronze Member
Username: Mekongdelta69

Grew up in Brooklyn an...

Post Number: 92
Registered: Apr-07
"MB - Did you ever build the Zigmahornets?"

>> Until I looked it up, I had no idea what 'Zigmahornets' were. I think you have me mixed up with someone else this time Jan.

[(Just for ref.) -- I'm the guy who asked about the hum on my Technics SP-15 before I fixed it and who also solicited advice about a CDP before I got a Saturn.]

M_____

.
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 5643
Registered: Feb-05
I certainly remember you Mike and so does Dale...! Hope you're still enjoying that Saturn.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 11758
Registered: May-04
.

Hell, I don't remember who I am at times!

Sorry, I thought you ordered a pair of Merrill drivers.
 

Gold Member
Username: Frank_abela

Berkshire UK

Post Number: 2528
Registered: Sep-04
MB, if you have a lot of glass to deal with, the curtains may improve the sound by reducing brightness...:-)
 

Bronze Member
Username: Mekongdelta69

Grew up in Brooklyn an...

Post Number: 93
Registered: Apr-07
I understand the [subtle] point Frank! However, the two windows are small; I like light during the day; I have other dampeners; and I don't notice too much reciprocity (i.e. HAF as opposed to WAF) in other parts of my house...
 

Gold Member
Username: Frank_abela

Berkshire UK

Post Number: 2533
Registered: Sep-04
I'm sorry - when you got married, didn't you read the small print? It reads:

What's mine is mine and what's yours is mine.

It's kind of part of the contract.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Mekongdelta69

Grew up in Brooklyn an...

Post Number: 94
Registered: Apr-07
I missed that part Frank, because my glasses had already been taken from me, so I wouldn't see my wallet being ripped from my pocket...

"I'll take what's behind 'Curtain' Number Three Monte."
 

Bronze Member
Username: Mekongdelta69

Grew up in Brooklyn an...

Post Number: 95
Registered: Apr-07
"Sorry, I thought you ordered a pair of Merrill drivers."

>> Wow Jan, you mean Robert Merrill drives right up to your house with speakers and then proceeds to give a live performance, so you don't have to mess around with those annoying little things like electronic components?

That's cooler than hell -- where do I sign up?!
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 9245
Registered: Dec-04
Actually, Mike, just 2 drivers, in Robert's car.
They have to tag team for the trip, you see.
Although now that you have ordered them, Robert will have to find others.

JV, CM has the Merrill's.
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