Do you think it'd be possible to bring a pair of JBL 4311s in store and hook them up to the system there to see what a difference in components can make on your speakers?
Well actually the question would be do you think they'd let me?
I could bring just one in, hook it up to that RB-1080 Rotel in bridged mode (360w 8-ohms and when the speaks dip to 4 ohms maybe 720? I dunno.) and see if I can get them to sound awesome or not. More importantly I should try them with the receiver I'm looking at.
I'm sure I can as they sound pretty good on the Scott (but not so on the Yamaha).
The question is if they would let me..
I don't think they (or my parents) would let me take home a pair of Paradigm Studio 60s, a Rotel RSX-1057, or a Pioneer Vsx-81Txv for an audition at home to see what it is I really am looking for.
Some will and some won't. You have to ask them yourself to find out. If you take to trying to blow up their gear like you do your own I'm sure you will wear out your welcome quickly, so if you get the opportunity go light on them eh.
Well it's a friend (my brother?) who runs the place so hopefully he'll let me.
Last time I was there I practically blew up a Seismic 12 subwoofer with my magical bass CD ...I had to Pre-Amp volume all the way up...and the sub as well...try to get a powerful 15hz tone. I did...but the room didn't like it. He had to screw some lights back in...and he was sweating..well hey he's the one who said I couldn't blow it...he was right...that's one thing.
Oh, and that sub's just fine...
The Studio 60s happened to be in that system (they were running 80hz crossover) and when I played that tone the drivers were moving pretty far. To comment on their extension...I played a bass track while he was hooking up the ML Depth (WOW! Great Sub For Integration...) I thought it was playing when the bass came in...but it was the speakers...interesting.
I don't think I could really hurt anything bringing the JBL 4311s in and hooking them up where the 800d's are bi-amped, each on 2 RB-1080s...
Let me tell you...they get LOUD! and sound great while doing it.
All I have to do is hook the speaker cables to my speaks...can't be that hard. I really wonder if it's possible for the KLH AV5001s to sound good...that'd be interesting to put 360w on them...(recommend amp power IS 350w for them you know...). It'd be cool if they actually sounded good..I'd be shocked. I'm not saying they sound bad they...maybe I should say make them sound better..
Anyway...the point is to find out whether to purchase speakers or a receiver... Hey in fact I've never had the KLH on my Scott Receiver R 357... I think I'll try that out to see something (they're only 50lbs each anyway).
I'll be back later..and tell you if they sounded good on the Scott like I KNOW the JBL's do.
The differences in the room/space will override any differences in amplification quality. The experiment will be flawed from its inception and will tell you nothing of value. Don't waste the time trying.
Well I did anyway...and since the JBLs sound better and get louder in both rooms I guess they're the better speaker.
I will tell you about it, though.
I unhooked the R Speaker in our system, identified the wires that hooked it up and put them down (don't worry the power to the receiver was disconnected).
I carried the speaker into the room (watching to make sure the corners didn't hit anything, of course) and set it down by the wall. I made up some speaker cable and hooked it up. Upon turn on, I set the station and turned the amp about 2 notches up. I was greeted with deep bass (But Muddy! ).
I Love Rock and Roll came on and so I played that as loud as the speaker drivers could take without overexcursion (much lower excursion than the JBLs...) and I went outside my room. I will admit that the pictures on the walls were moving around. Next up on the radio was Akon (yes Akon) and I forgot to turn down the volume...but I was happy because I didn't. I identified that the passive radiators on these shouldn't be the same size as the active driver....GRR...luckily it didn't go too far...it's limits were really close..but not passed.
The JBLs got way louder...but are the same efficiency. I'm saying they have higher Xmax basically. They sounded a lot better too! And do in the new room as well.
One thing I noticed and was annoying was that the KLHs are even brighter in my room. Actually...the bass limitations of the KLHs is annoying as well as their bad SQ...
It's getting harder and harder to decide on a receiver and speakers.
*If I go for receiver, I wonder if the MCACC would help* If I go speakers, I wonder if I'll have much bass (maybe the KLH's powered by the Scott hooked to the sub output?)
What would the main differences between the Studio 60s and these KLHs be? The Vsx-81txv and the HTR-5740?
Let me tell a few things before you (hopefully) answer that.
I first met the JBLs and Scott back when I lived in my first home (birth home I guess) and remember listening to Good Vibrations and really liking the sound it gave out.
House #2: We had there as well and I remember playing music and it was a VERY large room, but it still had that deep bass.
House #3: The room was around the same size here, but irregularly shaped. I remember playing Aaron Carter (Yeah...um...fuh-get uhbout et!) and I remember playing it loud and it sounded great.
Here: They still sound great. I don't know what draws me to them so. Here is when I bought the HTR-5740, KLHs, and Bose speaks.
It probably doesn't have much to do with the question, but what can ya do?
Where'd did you come up with "Xmax"? I know perfectly well what it is so don't explain that. You just seem to be fixated on "Xmax" and 120dB. Xmax has nothing really to do with why a speaker plays louder than another rated at similar efficiency.
Im just curious as to why your listening "outside" of the room you have the speakers in? I know you want loud and obnoxious, but being outside of the room and watching things rattle dont tell you a thing. Plenty of time, you'll learn. Keep listening to Jan, you'll get more out of that than the "experiments" you are attempting.
You've got plenty of ideas Andre, no problem with that, but your execution is in need of revamping.
I listened to some classical (among other music) and observed (with my eyes closed of course, in all fairness).
The KLH speaks sounded VERY wide, but didn't have much heighth to them. They didn't seem to have much detail, the highs didn't sound right and were distorted. The bass wasn't quite strong enough. On the good side, they sounded much better than a lot of stuff out there. It was overall pretty weak and bright sounding.
The JBLs sounded more "real"...if you will. The bass extension seemed much nicer and I could hear much more detail within the music. It was actually sorta scary...
The highs sounded more correct and the bass was more extended and sounded...complete.
The sound: I could see it happening with much more life in the orchestra and...how I can describe it is it sounded..real.
If I DO end up getting a new receiver I'll use the JBLs as the mains and use the KLH's as surrounds (The better speakers should be the mains right?).
If I get speakers...I'll have to experiment. My current receiver has only 40w (20hz-20khz .06 THD ALL channels driven, at least by the manual) right now and I don't know if I get a set of new speakers if the amp will make them sound horrible compared to what they can do. That's what I'm worried about. If I get the receiver, I'll know the speakers I have will have more power (is that going to help?) at hand and the processing and amplification would be upgraded along with expandability. The speakers are simple...yet so complicated.
Either one I get...I'll be stuck with it for about a year and a half until I get the funds to upgrade again. I do see the thing about DTS-HD etc. coming out...
Overall...I have no idea what I just said.
Thanks for input and *Advice* about pointing me just to the basics..
That's only a prediction and I only know that #1 is totally accurate. I've read so many things that say the speaker level I'm looking at (a lot of speakers) requires a fair amount of amp power and will show the weakness of the path before it.
The only way to know is bringing a speaker or two there and seeing how it mates with the proposed component. On the other hand...I could demo some speakers to try them out (so long I don't blow 'em up) if they let me.
I know it's probably not relevant, but I took that speaker hooked to my amplifier and had it turned it up to the highest point I've ever had it with the JBLs (the JBL's didn't distort), but I didn't realize it. I turned it on, and the speaker was like banging against it's stops really hard (keep in mind I was only using ONE channel of the amp AND had a 4-ohm speaker so it was getting like a 200w burst of power I'm sure) for like 2 seconds but I had it turned down by then. It was so distorted I couldn't tell what song it was until I turned it down...and it was some rap; no wonder.
After this little event I smelled burnt voice coil. I put my nose close to the cone and sure enough it was the speaker. That's alright, it still works. Next time I'll just watch the volume control to make sure I don't completely burn out the VC next time around. I'm sure it's a slightly different color now. Heh Heh HEH...
) who runs the place so hopefully he'll let me. 
...I had to Pre-Amp volume all the way up...and the sub as well...try to get a powerful 15hz tone. I did...but the room didn't like it. He had to screw some lights back in...and he was sweating..well hey he's the one who said I couldn't blow it...he was right...that's one thing. 
).