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Archive through February 22, 2007

 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1072
Registered: Nov-05
Web Guitar Wizard Revealed at Last - New York Times



http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/27/arts/television/27heff.html?ei=5088&en=5b993ce 30a7b7039&ex=1314331200&partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&pagewanted=all
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5528
Registered: Dec-04
JC, yes he is.

MR, thank you for that link.
The breakdown of the piece is a little too much for a guy who doesnt read music, but inspiring for all the self-taught players out there.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Bumpin612s

Post Number: 49
Registered: Jan-07
nuck
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 3845
Registered: Feb-05
I guess I've been out of the loop. I just found out that Michael Brecker passed away 1/13/07...wow. I saw him year before last with Herbie Hancock, Roy Hargrove, Brian Blade, and John Patitucci with the "Directions in Music" tour. It was and he was fantastic. Michael left us with an incredible body of work....RIP.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5573
Registered: Dec-04
RIP indeed, Art.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5574
Registered: Dec-04
I am not certain if anyone(other than me) has heard of, or read Mordecai Richler.
Here is a complete history of the confused, hypcrytical genius of a writer.
Canadian to the core(when it suits) and writer of the world(when the world would have him).

http://archives.cbc.ca/IDD-1-68-753/arts_entertainment/mordecai_richler/
 

Gold Member
Username: John_s

Columbus, Ohio US

Post Number: 1334
Registered: Feb-04
­
Thanks Art for remembering Michael Brecker in this thread. I knew he had some sort serious illness a year ago and missed the recent announcement of his death.

I always had great respect for Michael's talent on tenor sax. This respect was magnified because I knew his older brother Randy, who was equally talented on the trumpet. We were classmates at the Indiana Universary School of Music in the late sixties. At the time, Randy was top dog on jazz trumpet at the school. I was priviledged to play in a school ensemble with him.

Michael Becker's tenor will always resonate with even the most casual music listener, at the very least for his poignant solo on Paul Simon's "Still Crazy After All these Years." His music career went well beyond that of course, and his voice in music will be missed.
­
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 3848
Registered: Feb-05
Indeed John, Thank you for relating that experience. Michael won 11 Grammys and was as ecclectic a musician as any we'll ever see. The Brecker Brothers and their style jazzed up funk were entertaining and so too was the fusion of Steps and Steps ahead. Michael as a sideman played on so many records that even a casual treatment of his contribution would take longer than I have today. It was his talent as a leader that solidified his legend. Records like "Tales From the Hudson" and "Time is of the Essence" were jazz at it's finest. That said many of us will always remember Michael for his "Skunk Funk". I feel blessed to have seen him when I did. His energy on stage was unmatched by anyone I've ever seen and his talent as a soloist und improvisor was unbelievable. Again thanks John for your story and for remembering Michael.
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1082
Registered: Nov-05
Two recent excellent German discoveries (for me at least) are (a) Christopher Spendel Trio - Shanghai City lights. This is a smooth contemporary album. Piano (Spendel) Bass and drums. Great sonics and recording and musicianship- especially for those who like the milder jazz, though this does make those toes tap at times.

(b) For those who like a smooth female vocal, great keyboards and a bit of electronica thrown in - Jazzamour - A piece of my heart. Songs in english, french and german. This could be a great multichannel sacd though as redbook it has great sonics and good for letting your system express itself.
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1083
Registered: Nov-05
Meant to add my bit about Brecker - yes, a sad loss to jazz indeed.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5618
Registered: Dec-04
Enough morseness(I made that word up).

I finally got the sets of interconnect cables.
I will post them out for a roundhouse assessment.

Post here, then send your home addy.

Go.
 

Gold Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 9694
Registered: May-04
.


Send a pair. Call me.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5623
Registered: Dec-04
k
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5624
Registered: Dec-04
I meant email your addy to me.

Jan, Mike W, Art.

Any other takers for the last 2?
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5665
Registered: Dec-04
Tickets showed up today for the concert in March, the 14th.
Front row center for...























Meatloaf!
He's rounding 2nd base now and he's not slowing up at all...
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1097
Registered: Nov-05
The good thing about Meatloaf is he'll sound the same on any system.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5694
Registered: Dec-04
True enough, MR.
However, his range makes his delivery especially rewarding on a system with strong mid performance, in the 100-200 range.
Your setup really comes to mind.
Mine is just a little soft through the 90-120 range, but just to me, the others find it ok.

Overly critical, perhaps, but I am entitled, I think, bills to prove.

I model my vocals after MR. Loaf(?) quite often.
And Elvis.
 

Gold Member
Username: John_s

Columbus, Ohio US

Post Number: 1340
Registered: Feb-04
­
The good thing about Meatloaf is he'll sound the same on any system.
Upload

Meat Loaf's brand of Gothic rock isn't my cup o' tea, but I love those album covers!

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t171/JohnS45/Bat_out_of_Hell.jpg

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t171/JohnS45/Bat_out_of_Hell_II.jpg

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t171/JohnS45/Bat_Out_of_Hell_3.jpg
­
 

Silver Member
Username: Mike3

Wiley, Tx USA

Post Number: 242
Registered: May-06
Front and Center Nuck? I don't like standing for entire concerts so have fun with that.

I have Clapton and Cray later this month, 1st balcony just left of center. Never saw anything but the Mavs or Stars in the building so this will be a new experience for me. American Airlines Center.
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 3885
Registered: Feb-05
I have tickets to the first seven events on this list.

http://www.pdxjazz.com/sch.php?type=headline

Now that's livin'!!!!
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1098
Registered: Nov-05
You guys are lucky. Top artists are a plenty in your neck of the woods. With exceptions like Clapton and Cray for example, the more I age the more I prefer the lay back lounge jazz enviroment (or blues) for live music. Better to help keep the hearing intact.

Not knocking Meatloaf, Nuck, but I'm more like John S in that regard. When Mr Aday sings, he does so like there is no tomorrow. He was a riot in the Rocky Horror Show though.

Speaking of Clapton, watching the Crossroads DVD, I'm sure I saw Jan in the Dallas audience. Jan, was that you with the tats, cowboy hat and the Hawaian shirt, drooling on the stage in front of Eric as he was shooting the sheriff?
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5708
Registered: Dec-04
John S, M.R.
I would rather listen to a singer give his all than anything else, good or not.
Loaf has made a career out of singing like a demon, all heart and soul.
The guy leaves his heart on the stage. His spleen likely as well.
I want a performer to let it all out, nothing held back, nothing to hide, just flat out perform.Meatloaf could sing the phone book and bring a crowd to it's feet.
All heart, the sweat, the emotion, the pure drive of a song so well known, so loved, so emotional as to nearly drive a crowd into a tearful emotional frenzy.
That type of singer.
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1101
Registered: Nov-05
I'm too old for frenzies these day Nuck my friend, but I hear whachu sayin'!
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5711
Registered: Dec-04
A high five, MR.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5712
Registered: Dec-04
Who is Mrs. LOUD credited on the 'Outta hell albums?
I think it might be Bonnie Tyler, but she is not directly credited.
It seems to me that the woman who sang on the Bat outta hell album is also the one who was the first woman as the public attorney on 'Night Court". She was in a wheelchair then.
 

Gold Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 9707
Registered: May-04
.


"Jan, was that you with the tats, cowboy hat and the Hawaian shirt, drooling on the stage in front of Eric as he was shooting the sheriff?"


I won't stand all day on the floor of the Cotton Bowl, even for God. It was like the Pope's funeral for the last eight hours of the festival; if you had to go to the restroom, you might as well just do it where you stand. Besides EC has priced himelf out of my bank account's ability to keep up with his need for maintenance on his Porsches and his speeding tickets. At this point, I can only afford the Hawaian shirt.


Yahoo did a live video feed and Dish Network/Sirius did a live audio feed so I got to watch the event as it occurred with decent sound quality. I recorded the audio. Too bad the event got shortened by a storm.

.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5714
Registered: Dec-04
Oh Lord, won't you buy me a mercedez-Benz...
My friends all have Porcheeees, I must make a-mends...
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1102
Registered: Nov-05
The storm didn't suprise me - we got hot just watching the artists dripping through their shirts. Seems just like a Queensland summer. Great DVD though - with just a few exceptions. And anyone who has a Porsche and doesn't get speeding tickets doesn't know what they're for. [grin]
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5718
Registered: Dec-04
Which few exceptions, MR?

I think James Taylor looked just a tad uncomfortable there.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5727
Registered: Dec-04
Art, don't be late for Chick Corea.
Branford will likely remember you, too!

Very very good lineup there.
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 3892
Registered: Feb-05
"anyone who has a Porsche and doesn't get speeding tickets doesn't know what they're for"

Agreed!
 

Gold Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 9711
Registered: May-04
.

Actually, I thought J.T. gave one of the better performances of the Sunday groupings, marred only by the on stage buffoonery of Sammy Hagar. And I am hardly a fan of Mr. Taylor's work. But he did a straight forward performance that showcased a guitar style not heard from the other performers who immediately preceded and followed him. It was, after all, a guitar festival and a little finger picking was a welcome softening of the moment.


On a different note, John Mayer's level of skills(?) were woefully inadequate in his solo performance and most especially in the improv session with E.C., B.B. King and Buddy Guy. His final submission as he walked off the stage realizing he is not playing in the same ballpark, let alone the same league, as the other players made me wonder where this guy's career came from. Is his fame due, as so many seem to be today, made by who he is/was/might be sleeping with?

.
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 3901
Registered: Feb-05
I'm getting quite excited about the concerts Nuck. Stanko is just unbelievable. I saw him last year and to think that Charles Lloyd's group will be there the same day...wow!

I sampled John Mayer's most recent album on Your Music and liked it...perhaps he's better know as a songwriter.

Speaking of which that Your Music site that I first accessed on AK seems to be amazing. lots of cd selection for just 6.99 with no shipping. I have about 33 albums in my que.
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1104
Registered: Nov-05
Which few exceptions, MR?

Like Jan, I think John Mayer was a disappointment as was Jonny Lang, and one or two others I can't put a name to right now and I expected a bit more from ZZ Top. I liked Joe Walsh's performance but he really should check himself out in the mirror occasionally. Steve Vai put on a temendous display. Also the soundtrack (DTS) on the DVD was very good - no doubt another notch for Elliot Scheiner.

And Art enjoy those jazz performances you lucky son of a gun.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5735
Registered: Dec-04
I found Vai to be a bit over the top with 'the hell outta here', but somebody has to be!
I can't get a grip on Johnny Lang yet.

I just dig Walsh, and yes, he does rather look like Red Buttons at times.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5786
Registered: Dec-04
Anna Nicole Smith?!

ANNA NICOLE SMITH?!?!?!
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1117
Registered: Nov-05
Does she rate a mention?
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5787
Registered: Dec-04
Dead.
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1590
Registered: Oct-04
Sigh. So?
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 3938
Registered: Feb-05
Briefly met author Tom Spanbauer today at one of my favorite stereo haunts...he was buying a Cambridge universal player...I thought of you Larry and told him that he was in good company.
 

Gold Member
Username: Joe_c

Atlanta, GA USA

Post Number: 1372
Registered: Mar-05
Continuum by John Mayer is actually a half way decent album in my op. Much better than the first two.
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 3961
Registered: Feb-05
That's the one I sampled Joseph. I thought it sounded pretty good.
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1597
Registered: Oct-04
Art: If you should see Mr. Spanbauer again, please tell him never to put anything except polish on his CDs, OK? He works hard for his money, and can't afford to waste it on ruined CD players. (grin?)

respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 3963
Registered: Feb-05
Hey Larry I was at Powell's on Thursday just before going to the stereo store. That's where we usually meet folks. We picked up our grandaughter at Powell's then I walked 2 blocks over to Echo Audio http://www.echohifi.com/ and listened to some Acoustic Zen Adagio speakers with Parasound Halo electronics...nice.

After 3 mos with the demo Rega R5 speakers I finally got my pair and wow, the fit and finish is far superior to the demo's. The dealer must have picked up some pre production models at the show. Anyway mine not only look better they sound better. The spikes on the plith are located in a different place. The speakers are just enough different to make a sonic difference and as it turns out it's a good difference.
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1603
Registered: Oct-04
Art: wowzer, Echo sounds like the kind of place we SHOULD have here in Swampville - but do not.
Was reading a newspaper article today - which said that most people who "live" here get "consultants" to buy their stereo gear for them - put together a package and then just build it into place. Sigh.
I guess when you're rich. . . . .
I put "live" in quotes because of the number of people who own multi-million-dollar homes here, and only stay in them a few weeks or a couple of months a year.
I looked at your speakers Online, Art - they look neat, and I'm sure sound even better. Congrats.
Tomorrow - I call Cambridge. Ugh. . .

Have a great night and a prosperous week.

LR
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 4002
Registered: Feb-05
Thanks Larry. Wish you much luck with the Cambridge and a good week to you.
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1134
Registered: Nov-05
It appears old dogs such as John A, Simply McIntosh, John S, Rick Barnes, Don RX1, Sem, Two Cents, Asimo and maybe one or two others now have lives. Congratulations to you all and I hope all is well in your pounds.
 

Gold Member
Username: John_s

Columbus, Ohio US

Post Number: 1360
Registered: Feb-04
­
Woof! Woof!

This old dog is beginning to understand why old people move South.

Brrrr
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1605
Registered: Oct-04
John S - Arf and hmuphh to you, too, sir! Yes, we enjoy wonderful weather from November through May. But I'll trade you places June through October!
You like Big Wind, Black Mold, Soggy Shorts, Temper Tantrums, Wild Weeds, etc?
Hey - that's Swampville in the "rainy" season!
It's a trade-off, fer shore. . .
But with no state income taxes, a cap on property tax, no personal property or investment tax and moderate food costs - it's a purty nice place to be.

Plus - if you've ever been to Swampville - uh, pardon - NAPLES, you'll wonder why anyone would ever leave here. It's simply a beautiful area, and thanks to all the super-rich, all the main streets are clean and planted with trees, bushes and flowers. A joy just to drive around (even if I can't afford what's in the shops!!! GRIN)

respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1608
Registered: Oct-04
Cambridge trash: That's it, as posted on the tweaks thread. Sigh.

Art - Mer and I may eventually get to Portland, after all. She just came back from a fused glass seminar in Miami - run by the good people at Bullseye Glass, which, as you may know, is headquartered in Portland.
This ayem the team came by Mer's studios at the Bonita Art League - were impressed - and invited her out for some tours and classes and discussions.
She liked them, they liked her - and so. . . .
Will let you know if we ever do grace the lofty portals of Portland (grin).
Too bad the Rega only plays CDs. . .

respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 4025
Registered: Feb-05
Now Larry you know if you come out this way we won't let you escape without breaking bread together. Sounds like Mer had an excellent visit with the good folks from Bullseye. Love Portland!
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1611
Registered: Oct-04
Art: Oh, we'll break bread alright - unless you're prejudiced against scaley folk from Swampville! (double grin)

Yeah, good vibes all 'round there. The Bullseye folk are great - and what a company! They make glass that's so beautiful it eclipses most gems I've seen. . .

Mer loves working with and teaching fused glass - after years as a sculptur/painter. And the students - well, they just keep coming! As in, hooray! (grin)

Now - anybody want to give me a NAD M55? Eh?

(thought not. . .drat!)

Respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1138
Registered: Nov-05
Larry, I would have loved the M55 just on looks alone, but it has real issues. It sounded okay, but I didn't give a very good audition. The main problem is having to use the OSD to find the menu to change from surround SACD, 2 channel SACD, and the redbook layer. My Denon has a button on the remote and player facia for this and I don't need the telly for anything other than DVD movies. What a poor design! I think the cheaper T585 would most likely be similar.

That's great news about Mer! What a gal eh?
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1612
Registered: Oct-04
MR - Ouch, didn't realize the issues - surely they will have a fix soon? Or not. . .sigh.

Mer? Yeah, whadda gal. . .25 years of living with her has been better than any college education.

Respectfully to all. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: John_a

LondonU.K.

Post Number: 4618
Registered: Dec-03
M.R.,

I'm still checking in now and again. Just can't find much to say on current topics. Best wishes to all dogs, old and new!
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1142
Registered: Nov-05
Hi John A and John S, good to see you are both with us still, even if surrepticiously, lol!
 

Silver Member
Username: Sem

New York USA

Post Number: 650
Registered: Mar-04
Hi Johns S and A. Hi all.

Sorry Larry about your misadventures with your player. If you do end up going to Portland I do hope you can meet up with Art, I'm sure that would be a blast. I'm kicking my self for not getting in touch with you while Mrs. Sem and I were in Florida a few months ago. Turns out we weren't all that from from Naples. Maybe next time, if you're still there.
 

Gold Member
Username: John_s

Columbus, Ohio US

Post Number: 1362
Registered: Feb-04
­
Larry--a couple years ago I was in Swampville. Actually a mega-buck friend of mine let me use his condo down on Marco. I drove up to Naples once and yes, I could see I was in unfamiliar territory. Sure felt out of place, although I probably didn't look it as I was driving Mr. Rich's Porsche. Nice town. Wasn't during the rainy season so there were no soggy shorts.

M.R.: Thanks. Speaking of rainy seasons, I hear you could use some moisture down there. Still a drought there now?
­
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1620
Registered: Oct-04
Sem: Sorry we missed you. We welcome all Olde Dawgs in our humble manse!

John S. - Thank Goodness you had the decency to drive around in an "approved" vehicle! Mer and I are often the object of scorn in our humble Honda! (grin) Yeah, it's a nice town - and frankly a fine place to retire, unless you play golf. Average daily fees on one of our 135 courses is $200. And up. . .

John A - good to see your name again in print! Come back when you feel the urge to join in the fun.

My new Cambridge player should be here on Friday. I ordered "rush" delivery.

Happy Valentine's Day to all who celebrate such events. . .

Respectfully . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1152
Registered: Nov-05
John S - in most parts of the country the drought still prevails. Here on the Gold Coast, we have to put up with water restrictions even though our dam is almost full. Some stupid inter mayoral agreement in the south east of the state even though we neither supply nor draw water from elsewhere - yet!. There has been plenty of rain here this week - enough to keep me busy on my long steep, driveway with a pick and shovel.

Guys, the Gold Coast is the land of the rich here also, an old fibro shack on a small block of beachfront land sold for over 20 million just recently and I heard even that has been outdone. Every second car is a beamer or Porsche, others are high end 4wd's, then there's our humble old Mitsubishi we keep driving just to remind everyone else that this is still earth and that they haven't died.
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1622
Registered: Oct-04
MR - nice last line!
We're away to friends' house for dinner tomorrow - will take my black CD-R with - to see how (or if) it sounds on his Denon 3910. Which he loves. . .
If the disc sticks - uh - I may not get dessert! (grin)

As he thinks all tweaks are only for the nutty, well. . .

LR
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1156
Registered: Nov-05
I hope you get dessert Larry - something I have rarely these days (sigh) . Btw, I have tried the vinyl clad discs on our 3910 without problem.
 

Silver Member
Username: Two_cents

Post Number: 796
Registered: Feb-04
Hi folks! Thought I'd drop by to say hello.

Man, I'm beginning to envy the Old Dogs who grew up during the golden age of stereo. I'm currently putting together a modest vintage system for the bedroom, which so far consists of KLH Model 17 speakers (designed by Henry Kloss, an absolute genius) and a Thorens TD-160 turntable. I'm told both pieces were affordable for the masses back in the day. But boy do they sound fantastic! I love the looks of the gear, too. Real walnut and a linen baffle on the speakers. A nice wood plinth on the turntable. No plastic or vinyl in sight. They're obviously built to last. So, what happened in the late 70's and 80's that went so very wrong in the audio world? And does anyone have a Fisher or Scott tube receiver they want to sell me?
 

Silver Member
Username: Two_cents

Post Number: 797
Registered: Feb-04
Sorry about my post being off-topic. If there were a "Teaching a New Dog Old Tricks" thread, I'd post there.
 

Silver Member
Username: Two_cents

Post Number: 798
Registered: Feb-04
Oops, forgot being off-topic is the rule rather than the exception on this thread.
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1623
Registered: Oct-04
2C! Wowzer, I thought you'd sailed away to seek fame and fortune in the South Seas or something. . .(grin)

You're making me drool with nostalgic images, my friend. Had all of your gear way, way back - and yes, they did sound grand!

Wishing you luck with your, uh, retro setup. I doubt that you'll regret any time spent listening to it!

What happened in the 70s and 80s was that the record companies got upset about sales, and so they pushed to get a new generation of, well, "something."
What they got, of course, was the CD. And that's when our Hi got Lo and our Fi went Foo. We've been nurgling about ever since to get back to the "golden days" of the crackly old LP. Sigh.

Look's like you're well on your way. . .

A side note: the other day, BD (before disaster) I was pawing through some jazz CDs - and decided to play one with Stan Getz and the Oscar Peterson Trio. Sounded slightly muffled, but nice and warm.

Turns out that it was a MONO album made back in 1957. I sat there in the middle of the sound and just enjoyed it. Mono, for Pete's sake! Didn't even miss the "surround."

Again - welcome back - visit often.

Respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 9776
Registered: May-04
.


http://www.mapleshaderecords.com/audioproducts/electronics_main.php


What happened in the late seventies and early eighties was several things. The music industry learned it could create sales without having to get everyone in the studio at the same time. And the Japanese audio companies finally moved their production to Taiwan to further cut costs which allowed them to begin selling lots of features, lots of watts and lots of drivers.




On the other side of the equation, tubes became popular once again and high end audio moved into the "amp of the month" phase.


.
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1625
Registered: Oct-04
Back and forth. Up and down. Tube to chip. Chip to tube. LP to CD. CD to LP.
Does this ever end? (grin)

As the world turns. . .

LR
 

Silver Member
Username: Two_cents

Post Number: 799
Registered: Feb-04
Hi, Larry,

It's always good to hear from you, but sorry to hear about your player. If it's not the car, it's the audio equipment, eh?

I'm not surprised the mono Getz recording sounds nice. They were making great recordings in the late 50s through the 60s. The other night I listened to a wonderful LP from the early sixties, "Two of a Mind" with Desmond and Mulligan. Beautiful music and sound quality. As a Desmond fan, you're probably familiar with the album.

What seems to have happened in the 70's and 80's is a general decline in everything related to our hobby. Audio equipment became shoddily made with increased use of plastics (except at the high end). Vinyl records became thinner with inferior grade vinyl. Recording quality suffered with inept multi-miking and overdubbing techniques. The record companies tried to foist 8-track on the public. Then they succeeded with the cd. Everything became more disposable. What I don't understand is how all this happened all at once.


Jan,

Thanks for the link to the modded Scott. It's a little too rich for my vintage project. There are also reports on the web of poor workmanship on the Mapleshade mods. Part of the fun of putting together a vintage system is seeing how good of a system can be put together at a ridiculously low cost. So far I've spent $200 on the KLH speakers and Thorens turntable (including cartridge!). What can that get you at Best Buy? Two plastic boxes and a plastic spin-a-ma-jig. How much do you think a person has to spend to get the same sound quality and build quality as the vintage stuff?
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1628
Registered: Oct-04
2C - Oh, yeah! Also Mulligan with the Desmond Quartet - verrry smooth! I have the Two of a Mind re-mastered, on top of my jazz collection.

I always thought that Mr. Desmond performed better outside of the Brubeck Quartet - but some argue with me on that. Sigh. So, who am I, an expert? (grin)

So many performances - so little time!!!

Respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 9779
Registered: May-04
.

"How much do you think a person has to spend to get the same sound quality and build quality as the vintage stuff?"


Off hand I can't think of any mass market product that has the "build quality" of vintage gear. As with most things there is good and bad in that situation. Taken as a group, most mass market receivers are more reliable out of the box than what I was selling in the mid 1970's. By comparison, you could repair an Advent 400 table radio. The trend in most modestly priced electronic gear today is to build a disposable product. That's one reason I've put a cap on what I will spend for a CD player. By the time it needs any repairs, the parts aren't available and it is generally just as productive to buy something new with a warranty. On the vintage side, you must be careful what you choose. As parts supplies dry up, a vintage receiver can be rather costly to repair when the time comes. And vintage does not insure good quality by any means. 1972 transistors aren't typically all that pleasant to listen through.


In terms of musicality the vintage gear was designed by great people who had an ear for music. Kloss was a genius at what he did and his products do show his ability to create a product which remains true to the source. Unfortunately, that source was limited to about 13kHz response and had considerable noise at the frequency. It would be difficult to convince the average buyer of today that the paper cone tweeters on the 17's are better than a dome of some sort available on even modestly priced contemporary speakers. But, as has been proven on this forum numerous times, today's audio buyer is more often than not comparing the sound of the speakers they prefer to some unknown "reference" that is all too often their car stereo.


.
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 4038
Registered: Feb-05
Or their compuer speakers...
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 4039
Registered: Feb-05
Make that computer speakers...
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1630
Registered: Oct-04
Art, Jan, et al: see my "incredible day" posting on the Tweaks thread. Whadda day!!

LR
 

Silver Member
Username: Two_cents

Post Number: 801
Registered: Feb-04
"1972 transistors aren't typically all that pleasant to listen through."

Jan--Do you think Marantz and Harman Kardon receivers from that era are typical?

You're dead-on about the cone tweeters on the KLH 17's. That's the main deficiency of these speakers. The upper frequency range doesn't sound nearly as sweet as the mid-range. But what a lovely mid-range! The bass is respectable too, especially for bookshelf speakers.

BTW my reference speakers are Audio Physic Virgo II. They're a little better than car speakers or computer speakers.
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1160
Registered: Nov-05
And to think I'd spent all that time running back and forth between my car and the audio shops to get speakers that sounded right!





















Darn parking meters!
 

Gold Member
Username: John_a

LondonU.K.

Post Number: 4623
Registered: Dec-03
Really great story, Larry!

I think the new 'unknown "reference"' is the sound from the earbuds that come with an iPod.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5863
Registered: Dec-04
John, that makes my skin crawl.
 

Gold Member
Username: John_a

LondonU.K.

Post Number: 4625
Registered: Dec-03
That was not my intention, Nuck!

I've been thinking about Two Cents's question about what happened to HiFi. I am not so sure it all happened at once. Maybe it just looks like that from 2007. I was not really paying attention at the time!
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1634
Registered: Oct-04
John A - I'm not sure many "consumers" were paying that much attention - until it was too late.

So here's 2 Cents, going back in time. Makes my head reel with memories of my old Thorens TT and my Williamson circuit MONO amp - and what good times I had with them all! Good tunes, too! (grin)

I fired up my new/old Blaupunkt AM-FM-SW radio this morning - big thing, with amazingly fine-shape wood cabinet. Great sound came out - they built them solid in those years. No tubes, but still a mellow sound. Like yesterday. .Must be those paper-cone speakers? Hmm. . .

iPod, ummmm, yeah. . .

Respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 9781
Registered: May-04
.

"Do you think Marantz and Harman Kardon receivers from that era are typical?"


Yes, but of polar opposites in what was going on at the time. The HK was always the favorite of any shop where it was sold. The only line of receivers that really competed with HK was the first/second generation of Yamahas but they sold at a higher price and had a more extensive line of receivers. HK sold three receivers at the time with the 40 watt model being top of the line. I still have my Citation 12 Deluxe power amplifier and a HK730 receiver from the mid '70's. The Citation was considered high end at that time as HK marketed the Citation gear as "poor man's McIntosh". But both are twin power (dual transformers), dual mono, high current, high slew rate, low T.I.M. amplifiers. The Citation (a Stu Hegeman design) was built in New York and the receiver was assembled in N.Y. All HK design work orignated in N.Y. The 40 watt receiver sold for $499 retail and didn't get much discount. Unlike the larger 150 watt Citation 16 (with the LED's forming a front panel "V"), the 60 watt Citation 12 was considered to be "tube like" at the time, it being the first solid state Citation amp designed after the famous tube Citation series of products.




As I've said on the forum, I have never understood the contemporary consideration accorded old Marantz receivers. Saul Marantz never designed nor did he build a receiver. Saul was interested only in being in competition with McIntosh as the "world's finest audio equipment". He designed and built only separates and the Marantz 7c tube pre amp is one piece of my personal gear I wish I'd never sold off. The 8b amplifier, however, was no match for the MC240's I had by then. I never owned one but I set up many of the 10b tuner which is still considered one of, if not the, finest tuners ever built. Tube Marantz is, for the most part, well worth the money it gets today.



Once the company had been taken over by Superscope and Saul had relinquished all ties to the company, the Japanese/Taiwanese parent company had some of the original Marantz designers put together a few receivers with the "help" of the Superscope marketing department. A few were produced in California until the parts bins were emptied. The production shifted to Taiwan and Japan and the quality of the product suffered as did the marketing. The 2270B was the loss leader of the bunch and retailed for $599 for 70 watts per channel. It regularly sold for $299 - or whatever we could get for it. The schematic for the 2270B did not represent the parts (or even the circuits in some cases) that were often found inside the unit.


I've also told of the famous Marantz ad for the 2270B which showed a scorched cabinet and the text which indicated the receiver had been rescued from a burning house. The house burnt to the ground. The ad read something to the effect, " ... we replaced the power cord and it fired right up!" Of course everyone selling Marantz at the time was certain the 2270B was the cause of the fire but that fact had conveniently been left out of the ad.


Then there was the 2270B I took in trade for a separates system. The receipt for the receiver showed it had been purchased from a tire shop in Columbia, Mo., a college town. When I asked the client about the receipt he said he had picked it up on sale as the dealer had only had Marantz in the store for a few months and he had received a good deal on the demo unit. We all knew this was the result of Marantz/Superscope's floor plan of the time. Virtually anyone could have the line, fully stocked, for 90 days same as cash. If the dealer didn't sell the product after 90 days, Marantz took back whatever was left and moved it to the next "authorized dealer". The challenge became taking a Marantz in trade that had been sold at a doughnut shop but, to my knowledge, that never happened.


Marantz, Kenwood, Pioneer, Sansui and Technics soon got involved in the horespower race of the late '70's and turned out some unbelievable products. "Unbelievable" should not be taken as a compliment.


I did pick up a Marantz 2220B receiver at a garage sale a few weeks ago for $20. It does still work though the panel lights (unusual fuse lamps) are all burnt out. Maybe I'll hook it up some time and change my mind about 1970's Marantz.









Nah!
.
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 4047
Registered: Feb-05
I had a 2220B in the 70's with Altec 887A's and a Pioneer turntable. I loved that system. I also had one of those mid 70's HK receivers with 40 watts per side with KEF speakers and a Technics turntable....ahh the memories.
 

Silver Member
Username: Sem

New York USA

Post Number: 651
Registered: Mar-04
Intersting, though not much of anything we haven't heard or talked about here before.

http://www.avrev.com/news/0207/15.hiresaudio.shtml
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1653
Registered: Oct-04
Sem: Yeah, thanks for reminding me that I've probably invested a ton of money in a format that may or may not live another five years! Sigh.
SACD would seem to be the format of choice for the classical crowd - few others care a whit about it, especially in the age of the golden iPod.
When I read from all of you on this Forum that there are many "tweaks" around to make the old-fashioned CD sound better, if not good, well - maybe there is still hope for me and my kit. Don't know. . .

Sometimes I think we're beating heads against the wall with our feeble addings and subtractings - but in a few cases, notably the use of Pledge or Zaino, they actually seem to help.
Art's Rega - with it's "no top clamp" mechanism, has taken away one small sore spot. My Cambridge, and the new Denon 3930, for example, have done away with the controversial Faroudja chip for video playback, and have thus produced more stable video. Do we have a better chip for audio?
The person who finally solves the jitter problem - maybe Jan V? - will be Audio King, for sure.

Meanwhile, I do probably-dumb things like glueing bits of silicone to CD clamps, and polish away like crazy with a product designed to clarify racing car windows. Hmm. . .can the tight canvas coat be far behind? With the straps? (grin)

What can I say? SIGH

Respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 5923
Registered: Dec-04
It's sad and true Larry.

Jan, I really enjoyed the post.
 

Silver Member
Username: Two_cents

Post Number: 806
Registered: Feb-04
Jan, I also enjoyed reading your last post.

I might go in a different direction now. Still vintage but up the price ladder. I was offered a sweet deal on a Mac 2125 amp and C34V pre in mint condition. Not my first choices for Mac gear, but it's a great chance to try out the Mac sound.
 

Gold Member
Username: John_a

LondonU.K.

Post Number: 4630
Registered: Dec-03
Thanks for the link, Sem.

I like to listen to BBC's "CD Review". Their latest playlist is:-

CHANDOS CHSA5047 (SACD/CD Hybrid)
NMC D116 (CD)
LSO LIVE LSO0593 (2-SACD/CD Hybrid, budget)
DECCA 4705282 (2-CD, budget)
BIS CD-1697/1700 (15-CD, budget)
PENTATONE PTC5186164 (SACD/CD Hybrid)
LSO LIVE LSO0574 (SACD/CD Hybrid, budget)
LSO LIVE LSO0040 (CD, budget)
LSO LIVE LSO0593 (2-SACD/CD Hybrid, budget)
HARMONIA MUNDI HMC801954 (CD)

The review of that last one says "....But as the many polyphonic strands surround you -- and here they do surround you, thanks to this hybrid SACD...."

So it must be an SACD, too.

I get the distinct impression that the classical niche market, here, at least, is still busily adopting SACD, and because of multichannel, not resolution. DVD-A is nowhere to be seen.

This impression is also gained from browsing the new releases in the classical sections of the big West End stores.

Further to your article, the same stores are crammed with CD re-releases, in all genres. For classical, they are usually at budget or mid-price, too, meaning £5 - £10 per disc, and less for muti-CD sets. Rock/pop re-releases from, say, the 1960s are more expensive typically £10+ per disc.

I'd still rather have a disc than a download. Expecially when the whole disc including booklet, artwork, and jewel case is cheaper.

And the sound is better!
 

Gold Member
Username: John_a

LondonU.K.

Post Number: 4631
Registered: Dec-03
Sorry, 2c, posts crossed! Also Nuck, Jan. I am getting left behind....
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Australia

Post Number: 1182
Registered: Nov-05
Most of the classical sacdists on sa-cd.net are 2 channel fanatics John. I think the higher ones goes in equipment, the more is gained whether it two or multi-channel, much like CD players. Multi-channel still is the preferred option for me in the hi-res formats, but I get just as much enjoyment out of good CD recordings also. I guess the same would go for vinyl if I had a decent setup, though I don't care to start a vinyl collection or get involved in turntable maintenance and so forth.

The manufacturers are still making sacd and universal players, sacds are still being released at about 60 - 70 titles per month. Some recording companies are committing to sacd releases for the future. It may never be popular with the masses, but that could be a good thing - keeping quality reproduction levels high.
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1660
Registered: Oct-04
MR - classical "sacdists?" What a great word! I'm one, I guess - because, 2-ch or surround, I find the sound quality on most of the SACDs superior to Red Book CDs, though many new pressings come close.

I've given up trying to find any SACDs in local stores, and rely on the Internet for my purchases. Perhaps a larger city, such as Miami, would have some. . .

Tweak thread will outline my efforts to replicate Herbies mats. . .hmm.

Respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Silver Member
Username: Mike3

Wiley, Tx USA

Post Number: 258
Registered: May-06
Larry,

There are local stores you haven't tried yet.

There's a Half Price Books store, with a large collection of CDs and vinyl in Lexington and Louisville, Ky, St. Louis, Mo, and Dallas, Tx.
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1662
Registered: Oct-04
Michael: Yes, sir - but it's a heckuva long drive to any of them! (grin)

As I mentioned, I'm sure there are many stores that carry SACDs - just not within an hour's drive from our home.

See Tweaks thread for "amazing free offer."

Respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 4094
Registered: Feb-05
Hi Dawgs...in just briefly as I'm beat. The Portland Jazz festival is an incredible affair and I'm musically as well as spiritually recharged. Performances were unbelievable with some surprises thrown in. Beautifully organized the festival doesn't just invite it, it almost demands participation on a personal level. The wonderful Jazz Dialogues where you get to know more about an artist and his/her life and passions to meeting the artists after the performances this is a festival that unites the music lover with the real source. It was an unforgettable 3 days for Sherylin and I.

One little hint, if you want to hear something really different, buy the record by Trygve Seim "Sangam". Their performance in the First Congregational Church in Portland was one of the most unusual I've seen. Goodnight all.
 

Gold Member
Username: John_a

LondonU.K.

Post Number: 4633
Registered: Dec-03
It's difficult to follow that, Art!

Welcome back. What a pleasure to read your last post.
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 4114
Registered: Feb-05
Thanks John...I'm still processing last weekend, wow!
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1681
Registered: Oct-04
Art: As I work my way through the black mat experiment, I've also been chatting with friend Verne about your conundrum - the apparent backward degradation of sound on your Rega.

Well - he posed the problem to his LA friends - to some like-minded souls at a large San Francisco stereo club, and to members of the International Audio Society.

Generally, they were stumped. But one chap did say that the Rega is considered a "very bright" machine, and thus the Zainoed discs might bring out even more of this brightness.

When I mentioned your "glare" problem - Verne said the group understood, but had no real solution for you. In fact, they were confused. The problem, as they see it, is jitter, and thus a better disc surface with its accompanying more accurate laser reading, should create less, not more jitter.

Several of them are ardent disc-cleaners, and claim that it reduces jitter by a measurable amount. Verne pointed me to an IAS article - let's see if I can copy the link here:
- - - - -
http://www.iar-80.com/page54.html
- - - - -
The article deals with all manner of disc-tweaking, and Verne said it would help me understand a lot of what we're trying to do.

If these guys can't help - well, I give. . .

Respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1683
Registered: Oct-04
Art: I think this one quote from the article linked above might well zero in on your problem?
- - - - - - -
Most of these fluid tweaks that we have evaluated are not wholly positive in the sonic changes they wreak. That is, the sound gets better in some respects, but worse in others. Typically, when we try treating a new CD with these fluid tweaks, we find that the midrange gets better (more musically natural, with better inner detail) but the treble gets worse (fuzzier, sometimes dirty, and defocused, with poorer articulation). But for now the point is that virtually all the fluid tweaks do indeed make a difference, which demonstrates that changing the analog eye pattern input signal does indeed change the ultimate sonic output from your CD player.
- - - - - - - - - -

Happy un-Zainoing!
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 4129
Registered: Feb-05
Exactly Larry. Nice quote...that hits the nail on the head.

"The problem, as they see it, is jitter, and thus a better disc surface with its accompanying more accurate laser reading, should create less, not more jitter."

That statement doesn't really surpise me because I don't think that the problem is jitter. Again you have to remember that I'm not saying that the sound is brighter per se but has a different character that I call glare for lack of a more descriptive term.

The quote on your last post really is very accurate relative to what I heard. Midrange information appears to be enhanced at the expense of treble articulation. The running together of what used to be separate sounds may be partly what I'm referring to as glare.

Well I just heard the dinner call. Back later.
 

Gold Member
Username: Larry_r

Naples, FL

Post Number: 1685
Registered: Oct-04
Art: sorry for all your angst, my friend. I find out more and more about sonic problems as I go along. Sigh.

I'm having a hard time with the concept that a cleaner, shinier disc presents more problems than a "dirty" one, and look to all the Dawgs for help on this!

I got so much information from the linked article that I put on this thread. Mad a LOT of sense to me - except for the part involving the Art-problem.

In my case, there is no contest: cleaned discs sound and look light-years better. Period. I'm thinking that your problem must have something to do with the Rega's computer and what it does to shape sound? Guessing here. . .

You - Art - are the only person I've ever heard/read who has found the Zaino or Pledge to degrade, rather than enhance, sound quality. A puzzle, for sure. . .

Please let me know what happens when you get the Zaino OFF the discs - and whether the Dawn works as well for you as it has for me. I always start out with the most innocuous solutions, then work my way up to such things as mineral spirts as last resort.

Happy scrubbing!

Respectfully. . .LarryR
 

Gold Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 4131
Registered: Feb-05
Still not had the chance to do any removing. Perhaps in light of the quote you posted earlier degrade may not be what I meant to say as much as I mean that the sound changed in a way that made it less pleasant to listen to for me.
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