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SVS Giant has arrived!

 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 490
Registered: Feb-05
It has arrived and so far the news is not so good! To start with it was poorly packaged and shipped carelessly. Then the cable I ordered was only a single when I need a pair. Then I hook it up and I can feel the behemoth cabinet vibrate when delivering even a little bass. As for the bass at this point I would rate it as one of the least articulate most directional I've heard. Boy I sure hope it improves cause for now it sucks. Oh and huge does not even begin to describe it. Unless things change in a hurry I will be back in the sub market, out a whole lot of shipping money.
 

Silver Member
Username: Petergalbraith

Rimouski, Quebec Canada

Post Number: 568
Registered: Feb-04
Ouch!

Sorry to hear that... :-(
 

Silver Member
Username: Edster922

Abubala, Ababala The Occupation

Post Number: 555
Registered: Mar-05
Art,

I'd suggest contacting SVS directly, they're known to be very good about taking care of problems like this and also to provide very good advice on setting up and positioning their subs.

Which model is it, BTW? I don't recall seeing a "Giant" model on their website, unless that's just your designation.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Mauimusicman

Post Number: 63
Registered: Apr-05
Probably got damaged in shipping given that they packed it poorly....SVS doesn't sound too impressive from any aspect right now though.
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 491
Registered: Feb-05
The model is PB-12 ISD/V. Edster I put this sub where the other one was which is the only place in the room for it. I'm going to listen to it some more but I get the feeling that SVS is a home theater sub not a music sub. If it doesn't work out that leaves me back at square one. Yikes! Unless you've seen this thing live you can't appresciate it. I have no idea how I would ship it back. I have no vehicle that it will fit in. I believe that this is why Paul was skeptical of internet direct products. If I'm dissatisfied I am out a bunch of bucks for shipping, a back from carrying, and a whole mental health.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Mauimusicman

Post Number: 64
Registered: Apr-05
Try HSU next!!!
 

Silver Member
Username: Paul_ohstbucks

Post Number: 956
Registered: Jan-05
yep, that sounds like the 'internet' purchasers nightmare. Since you already have a good sub, I am a little suprised that you bought the 'starter' SVS. Im a little curious(based on your circumstances)why you wouldnt spend a little more to buy one of their better subs if you were trying to upgrade since you already own a sub that is well over the 'starter' category.

If you had a budget system, and no sub to begin with, maybe the econo SVS would be a good choice, but based on what I've read from your posts, that couldnt be further from your current situation.

Since you've discussed the great sub you already owned, I was a little suprised to see you bought an entry level sub as an upgrade.
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 492
Registered: Feb-05
The reason I bought this sub is because of the stated testimonials that it sounds better than any sub under 1k competitor which qaulifies my $750 Paradigm as one it should sound better than. I don't think that this is considered entry level as the Outlaw which is highly rated and the top of the line Hsu are all in the same price range. And Paul you've seen my salary, heh man I was lookin' for a bargain. I believe that if I were to spend more on a sub I would buy a REL or a Vandersteen, great for music. Live and learn. Oh and the jury and all the way back in court on this one yet. It may just be that it sounds so much different than I am used that I will need to adjust, we'll see.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Mauimusicman

Post Number: 65
Registered: Apr-05
Well, at least you have time to get used to it or figure out a way to ship it back to SVS. I would definately take Edsters advice and give them a ring either way. Good luck Arthur.
 

Silver Member
Username: Paul_ohstbucks

Post Number: 957
Registered: Jan-05
Well, I hope it works out for the best for you. To be honest, when you said you were getting the ISD, I figured you were planning to add it to your current setup, and not replacing anything. Ya know....going by the two is better than one theory.
 

Silver Member
Username: Petergalbraith

Rimouski, Quebec Canada

Post Number: 570
Registered: Feb-04
Call SVS...

A fast sub should sound equally good on music as it does with movies. Was it damaged in transit? You say it wasn't packaged well, but what happened to it? Is the box okay? Is the sub scratched? Do you have evidence that it was dropped?
 

Silver Member
Username: Paul_ohstbucks

Post Number: 963
Registered: Jan-05
How was it packaged?? Mine came on its own pallet and was packaged to the max. Inside the big box, it was tightly packed with thick black foam. You could beat the box with a baseball bat if you wanted and the sub wouldnt feel a thing.
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 493
Registered: Feb-05
The box was broken but not compromised to the point that the sub was actually damaged. I listened to it for a while longer last night and determined that the problem is the ports. Also I believe that the cabinet is too big. The cabinet vibarates a bit and I didn't have that with the previous sub. I have however remedied the situation. I called my friends at Bradford's and they are going to give me 100% trade in on my Paradigm PW2100 for a B&W ASW750 with slight cosmetic damage (you have to be looking for it to notice). The B&W is a sealed enclosure with a 12 inch driver and 1000 watt amplifier. They use it to demo with their Magnepan 3.6's and it integrates beautifully. It was a sub that I didn't consider because of its hefty $1700 price tag. But the $750 trade in and $300 off for the cosmetic damage I only pay $650 for it. I am thrilled and I pick it up on friday. I will keep all posted. By the way I called SVS...they are clueless. They are a home theater sub company with no regard for or knowledge of the needs of folks for whom music is important. Eric encouraged me to get rid of my seperates and buy an AVR...great advice don't you think.
 

TV
Unregistered guest
Hi Art,

I'm sorry to hear the SVS isn't performing up to your satisfaction. We will make returning it as painless as possible if that is your decision. We can usually arrange for the shipping company to pick it up right at your address at whatever time of day works best for you. So you don't have to worry about that. The enclosure is made from 1" thick MDF and it is very well braced. The baseplate also acts as an external brace. So any enclosure vibration is quite minimal. The subwoofer weighs close to 120 pounds...that shows it isn't lacking for baffle strength..:-) If your unit is "vibrating", then it really sounds like it may have been damaged in shipping( your description of the shipping box also supports this to some degree)

Please feel free to email me at techsupport@svsubwoofers.com and we might be able to dial in the SVS a little better for you. We have extensive experience matching our subwoofers to a wide variety of 2 channel systems...including hard to match dipole and electrostat mains.

Tom V.
SVS

 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 494
Registered: Feb-05
I will email you after work Tom. State worker can't email you from here. I appreciate your concern but I have already committed to buying the B&W from my friend at Bradford's. We'll discuss it later. If you could email a phone number that would be easier as troubleshooting by email is difficult.
 

Silver Member
Username: Edster922

Abubala, Ababala The Occupation

Post Number: 556
Registered: Mar-05
Art,

well you are certainly breaking new ground here...I have never read anyone disliking their SVS purchase on any audio forums, and I have read quite a few subwoofer threads on many different forums.

My guesses are:

1. The sub was badly damaged during shipping.

2. This particular sub model is not suited for your music-oriented tastes/uses.

3. The sub was simply defective from the factory---maybe you just got one of the bad apples?

BTW from what I've read, Eric at SVS gets the least favorable feedback from consumers, Tom and especially Ron seem to be the two most knowledgeable and helpful people there...so you might want to contact either of them.

Sorry about your bad experience, though.

The B&W sub sounds awesome...but with a $1700 regular price it darn bettter though! : )
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 496
Registered: Feb-05
Hi Edster,

There is another SVS detractor elsewhere, I have found him a couple of times by accident but he is the only other one that I have found.

Eric is not too bad, he is not the friendliest guy, but I could live with that if he had a clue what he was talking about. When I first called Eric he couldn't understand how I had my setup configured which seems odd for a professional. When he finally "got it" he tried to convince me to get rid of my 2 channel gear and just keep the Marantz AVR. He told me that he has a Denon and that it is good enough. I politely told him that it may be good enough for him but it don't work for me. After all I am the customer and I value 2 channel music most of all.

I don't think that the sub is damaged or defective. I believe that with that much cabinet real estate it will vibrate a bit no matter how solid. Also the port noise causes directionality. Tom and Ron might me nice but how would I know through this process. I need to speak to someone when troubleshooting and I asked for a number to call after all Eric stated that they could do the phone thing but I have not received a reply. But really I have been doing this for a while, some of my favorite audio stores call me in to get my opinion on whether new speakers sound good and do they have them set up right. I know how to set up a sub. This one just doesn't work for me.

So Edster I believe that you are right. This sub just is not suited for my needs. It doesn't mean that it is not a good sub it just doesn't fit my application. So Friday I pick up my new B&W ASW750. Rock on man!
 

Silver Member
Username: Edster922

Abubala, Ababala The Occupation

Post Number: 560
Registered: Mar-05
You have corroborated most accounts I've read about dealing with Eric, that he's kind of a space cadet and also is very lacking in people skills. Any customer service rep who starts giving receiver advice to an irate subwoofer customer, is either a dingbat or he's trying to divert attention from the fact that he's clueless on what to tell you about the subwoofer.

I believe I read somewhere that the larger the cabinet the deeper and/or stronger the bass, at least that's the theory and I suppose for HT folks who are mainly after the biggest bone-shaking rumbles that's what closes the deal.

BTW I wonder if your sub would sound any better if you used the LFE pre-out on it? Worth a try...

Somebody else also recommended a sealed enclosure to me given my musical orientation, so I'm very curious to read about your experience with the B&W.
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 497
Registered: Feb-05
Yeah, I can't wait to get the B&W. The most musical subs I've heard are the REL's, Era's, and the Vandersteen and they are all sealed enclosures. My gues is that the SVS's sound pretty good for home theater but I won't get that far. I had considered getting on of the cylinders until I called my friend at Bradford's and he offered me the great deal on the B&W.
 

Silver Member
Username: Jamesp

Mansfield , TX USA

Post Number: 120
Registered: Apr-04
Art,

I have auditioned the ASW-675 and was not as impressed with it as I am with my HSU VTF-3. If you have a smaller room the ASW will do fine. If you have a larger room the B&W may not be enough.

Just my two cents.
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 503
Registered: Feb-05
The 600 series ain't the 700 series. I agree with you the on the 675. Remember, I am not looking for bumpin' and thumpin'.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Vgtvidz

Post Number: 53
Registered: Jul-04
Clean bass is the way to go.

as for erik from SVS, I emailed him and the answer I received was kinda deceiving. I asked him why I should go with SVS PB-10ISD over HSU VTF2 MK2 and the answer was something like : Well, SVS is better to reproduce low frequencies.
I mean, this is probably true but I was kinda expecting more from a salesman!
 

Silver Member
Username: Paul_ohstbucks

Post Number: 974
Registered: Jan-05
Im not so sure that he is a 'sales' guy. When I talked to him, he sounded more like a production manager who's also responsible for taking sales calls. Anyway, thats my take....and I'm in sales.

I also agree with your 'clean bass' comment. You can have your cake, and eat it too if you buy a good sub. It's very true that good clean bass can also rearrange your deck funiture outside if you buy a good enough sub. Whoever said that good clean bass has to be weak and underpowered????
 

Silver Member
Username: Frank_abela

Berkshire UK

Post Number: 539
Registered: Sep-04
Art

Sorry about this but I don't rate the B&W very highly - it's the ports again, and the cabinet is fairly big and noisy. You should listen before you buy, or agree with your friend that you can swap it back if necessary. The most musical sounding subs I have heard have been these:

REL ST range (i.e. the Stampede and Strata V)
M&K MX700B and KX-10

Interestingly these are all sealed units - no ports!

I have not heard it myself, but I am told by people whose opinion I value that the Velodyne subs are also very musical (and guess what? they're sealed units too!). If you get the expensive one (not an option I guess but hey you never know), you get their model with the software that checks the room's response allowing you to setup the sub such that you get a flat *in-room* response!! This is the only sub on the market that can do this that I know of, but it remains musical allegedly.

As to needing big cabinets to achieve deep bass, this isn't exactly true. The M&K MX700 has a flat response to 20hz and has very useable output into the mid-teens, yet it's a relatively small cabinet with two 8inch drive units. It's awesome.

Regards,
Frank.
 

Silver Member
Username: Edster922

Abubala, Ababala The Occupation

Post Number: 568
Registered: Mar-05
Frank,

I'm afraid to ask, but just out of curiousity about how much do those M&K subs go for? I was also very impressed by one, but it was in a client's house and I didn't want to be asking him what he paid.

I don't think it had two drivers but it sounded great and looked to be no more than a 10" woofer, coupled with a so-so Sony ES receiver and M&K in-walls (also very moderately sized) in a fairly huge room with 15 foot cathedral ceilings---I'm sure Paul won't believe me, but it sounded fabulous!
 

Silver Member
Username: Petergalbraith

Rimouski, Quebec Canada

Post Number: 582
Registered: Feb-04
Isn't the 15" Titanic sealed?

People on the Klipsch forum say it's very musical. And it's only $650 with free shipping (for you Amricans that is).
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 504
Registered: Feb-05
Frank, sorry but wrong answer ... it has no ports. It is a sealed enclosure. Perhaps you are talking about a different sub. The cabinet is actually smaller than the comparable REL. I have heard the sub, they use it in their high end demo room with their Magnepan 3.6's. Look on the B&W site and you'll see that you have mistaken this sub for another. I agree with you that some B&W subs are sub par but the 700 and 800 series are very good.
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 506
Registered: Feb-05
Behold the new sub and specs http://www.bwspeakers.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/products.models/label/MODEL%20ASW 750. I found a place where a consumer compared it directly to Paul's new sub. I will post it this evening when I get home. I can only post while on lunch at work and I have it saved at home. Frank, please don't take my comment as rude I just know that you are talking about another sub. Someone posted a comment on the 600 series earlier which is not relevant to the one that I am getting. It's kind of like comparing the Paradigm PW2200 to the Servo 15.
 

Silver Member
Username: Edster922

Abubala, Ababala The Occupation

Post Number: 576
Registered: Mar-05
wow, that's one sweet sub, goes down all the way to 20Hz too! Not sure I'd ever spend $1700 for a sub but it's nice to window shop... : )
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 508
Registered: Feb-05
$1700 is a bit steep for my budget. I'm glad I'm just paying $650 after trade in. It is a killer sub indeed. Any sub that can keep up with Maggies is doin' somethin'. What HiFi! rated it 5 stars and gave it a best buy designation. Im pretty pleased. It just goes to show what having a relationship with a good dealer can mean to you.
 

Silver Member
Username: Frank_abela

Berkshire UK

Post Number: 544
Registered: Sep-04
Art,

My mistake about it being ported, but it was the 750 we had in the shop. We had real problems getting it to integrate and with noise from the cabinet (perhaps that's why i thought it was ported). That said, you've heard it and like it so enjoy!

Edster

I don't know what the retail prices for M&K are in the US. If we go with the usual $/£ ratio that is applied, their entry level KX-10 would retail for around $550 and the MX700 about $1350. That said, they could be cheaper for all I know. They make several subs, the only one that does not hit 20hz *flat* (i.e 0db!) is the KX-10 AFAIK. They're the first subs that I can genuinely say I can't hear. It's the weirdest thing to have a set playing music, preferably with a bass guitar on the left and then switch off the sub on the right and hear it all vanish. Eerie...

Regards,
Frank.
 

Silver Member
Username: Paul_ohstbucks

Post Number: 984
Registered: Jan-05
That's kind similar to the experience from when I first turned my sub 'on'.

I was like.....whoah, something here is very different. I wouldnt know about music though since I dont listen to any......:-)

Ok, maybe in the car when Im not in the mood for my favorite talk radio shows."laugh" I had a boombox playing out in the back when I stained my deck 2 weeks ago.....does that count?
 

Silver Member
Username: Edster922

Abubala, Ababala The Occupation

Post Number: 586
Registered: Mar-05
Frank,

yep that M&K was practically invisible. I'll have to call around sometime for prices...
 

Silver Member
Username: Edster922

Abubala, Ababala The Occupation

Post Number: 587
Registered: Mar-05
Paul,

oh my God please tell me you don't listen to those AM retards like Michael Savage and Rush Limbaugh...
 

Silver Member
Username: Petergalbraith

Rimouski, Quebec Canada

Post Number: 594
Registered: Feb-04
One last quick question about the SVS sub...

Did you calibrate the level with an AVIA DVD or something? It's often surprising how low it's supposed to be set. Maybe it's on too high?

I feel silly asking this to Art since he knows what he's doing...
 

Silver Member
Username: Edster922

Abubala, Ababala The Occupation

Post Number: 595
Registered: Mar-05
yeah Peter, what's an Avia DVD?

(just kidding)
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 514
Registered: Feb-05
B&W ASW 750 in da haus! Wow what a nice sub. Beautiful to look at with prodigious output and musicality...nice. I auditioned it against the Era Sub 10 (incredible sub by the designer of the great REL subs). The Era was tighter with less output. Both were excellent making it a tough call. I chose the B&W but reserved the right to change my mind if it doesn't produce at home. So far, so good, but you know how that goes. You have to live with it for a few days before you know for sure (unless it's very obvious from the start).
 

Bronze Member
Username: Thx_3417

Bournemouth, Dorset United Kingdom

Post Number: 72
Registered: May-05
Art,

Hi there.

This sounds a whole like Clash of the titans, my friend is looking for a nice B&W but when I said there is SVS it went past him at light-speed! He likes my JBL 4645 but standing 3ft 6in 2ft 2in and 1 ft and 6in that's a whole lot of momma.
http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.jmgkorea.com/image/cinemasol ution/4645c.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.jmgkorea.com/page/cinema%2520solution/4645c .htm&h=218&w=153&sz=11&tbnid=1wlwjnONwDMJ:&tbnh=101&tbnw=71&hl=en&start=3&prev=/ images%3Fq%3Djbl%2B4645%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26sa%3DN

http://www.svsubwoofers.com/subs_pb12_isd_v.htm
That is nice my friend would

Still can't get over that size does matter, http://www.formfunctionemotion.net/mt-static/images/yoda.jpg

http://www.starwars.ndo.co.uk/episodes4-6/yoda.jpg
You must feel the SVS all around you hear, the tree the rock and the ship too.

What am I saying, no JBL I'm not under rating the JBL 4645.

Ashley

 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 515
Registered: Feb-05
Sorry I didn't anwer your question Peter I didn't see it. For 2 channel you have to calirate by ear. For home theater you can use an spl meter especially if you have the sub hooked into the LFE on your AVR which I do not.

Hi Andy. It really isn't a battle of the titans as I know that there are plenty of subs with greater output than ones I listened to today. I was looking for a sub that handled music and movies with equal aplomb.

The SVS definately has a lot of bass. Don't be put off by my experience. I feel that the SV sub was a fine performer it just did not meet my needs.
 

Silver Member
Username: Petergalbraith

Rimouski, Quebec Canada

Post Number: 602
Registered: Feb-04
Sorry I didn't anwer your question Peter I didn't see it. For 2 channel you have to calirate by ear. For home theater you can use an spl meter especially if you have the sub hooked into the LFE on your AVR which I do not.

Well, you could feed the AVIA tones to 2 channels whether you crossover at the sub or use LFE output.
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 516
Registered: Feb-05
You, could but I wouldn't. Most newer high end DVD players wont even play the Avia disc, that is one of the reasons they are updating the Avia. Also, as soon as you switch from one player to the next you need to recalibrate and it is the CD player and music playback that I am most concerned with. I believe that I got the best I could out of the SV sub given the location I had to place it in. It really is a good sub especially if you're needs run more to home theater. I still have not found a satisfying sub and don't believe I will until I spend a whole lot more money. I listened to a great McIntosh sub today but it was out of my price range. This new B&W is very competent and will hold me over for quite some time. It's kind of weird listening to a front loaded sealed sub. It takes getting used to because it behaves differently than I am used to. It is very tight, no hangover on bass notes. You hear that on servo subs but not usually on this type of sub. I haven't done the movie thing with it yet but I would guess with its output it should be fine. More on that later.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Mauimusicman

Post Number: 68
Registered: Apr-05
It stinks when your tastes are too much for your wallet. Enjoy your new toy Art; it certainly appears to be right up your alley. Im still surprised that the SVS wasn't all it was cracked up to be, but so be it.
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 519
Registered: Feb-05
Hey guys guess what I accidentally tripped the low pass filter switch off, no wonder it sounded a bit strange. I turned it back on, and oh lord how sublime. I am listening to Jacintha "Autumn Leaves", incredible album....reproduced incredibly.
 

Silver Member
Username: Paul_ohstbucks

Post Number: 991
Registered: Jan-05
Shucks.......does anyone know where I can order some 'paperweight' GMAs to sit out on my back porch?
 

Silver Member
Username: Paul_ohstbucks

Post Number: 993
Registered: Jan-05
recali....oh nevermind...

Gees, use your ears folks!! People are way too @nal, and for that, their sound will suffer.
 

Silver Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 520
Registered: Feb-05
Yo Paul wassup man. Did you get some GMA's to compliment your sub. What movies did you watch tonight Alien vs Predator or did you settle down with some popcorn for a Michael Moore flick. Not!Hope you're enjoying movie night with a beer or a bourbon or both.
 

Silver Member
Username: Paul_ohstbucks

Post Number: 995
Registered: Jan-05
Hahahaha....

I went for the big explosion flicks last night:-)
Wow, it sure was fun~!!! I had a major marathon and watched 3 flicks noted in the other thread. And yes, the beer was tasting awfully good.
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