Hi i have a mtx mxs1204 sub and a alpine mrp-m1000 amp the sub hooked up to it and its decently loud but im wanting louder and am torn between trying out 2 rockford fosgate P3s or a single rockford fosgate t2 sub as max power i can get outta this amp is 1000watts rms and those both should fit the amp nicely and am wanting bass i can feel in the chest if any one has any feed back or different options for sub brands or size i would appciate it and if you are reading this glasswolf i fixed all my gain problems and it did get louder and sound better but i still want louder then what 1 mtx mxs1204 can produce and car is a 96 cavalier so help out with trunk size as i think i could only fit 2 12inch subs to one 15inch sub
Jason, are you dead set on RF subs? Honestly, Rockford's subs are far from outstanding when it comes to performance. The MTX you have now I can understand wanting to replace, since it is an entry level sub, but there are much better options available, like the Alpine Type R, Fi SSD, DD99xx series, RE XXX or SX, and so forth.
I started out using rf in the early to mid 90's. i've always had a soft spot for them. that being said. the t2 is way to expensive for what it is. around 450 on ebay. you can get a far better sub for half the price. look at the online companies listed by glass. dd, re, fi even audioque to name a few. take your time and ask questions. we've all wasted money and will try to help you not make the same mistakes.
wow glass big selection, type r, ssd, and dd 99 series and re xxx in the same sentence. don't hear those subs compared much. anyway RF is decent at best look around youll find something way better. on ebay theres sundown sa12's for like 189shipped, or maybe some t3 t600 i think there like little over 100 bucks.
I was simply stating that there are a myriad of better subs available depending on his budget. RF is OK, but not stellar. Yeah I used to use RF and Orion in the early 90s, when they were all made in the USA, designed in the USA, and some of the best gear made, but times change.
The older RF subs are good, but the new ones I wouldn't recommend to anyone. You can just get a lot better, like everyone is saying. If you do want to go with RF and want to go with two good subs, look for a pair of Punch HX2's. If you want to run one sub, look for the Power HX2. They're not made anymore but you can find them around time to time.
thanks for the input i looked at all subs you guys talked about. I figured the alpine type r are pretty much the same thing as the rockford p3s. But now im thinking about going for those Fi ssd subs or the RE sx. But as i said the amp im using is a mrp -m1000 so i only get 1000rms outta it at 2ohms. But was wondering if I could get 2 12inches of either brand and would they run fine off that or be underpowered. Thats why I was also thinking of just getting one over the top sub to compensate thats where the rockford t2 came into play. Price is not much of a problem as long as its not a morgage. I was thinking 500-700 dollars I figure that should get some pretty good subs oh and I do have a place near me that sell DD subs/amps since I can't really find those on ebay at all finding the place was kinda random. As I live in canada and it seems to me car audio places are like finding a needle in a hay stack. Other then best buy or future shop. Yes I know I go on and on but I don't post on forums that often just starting to get into car audio with a friend of mine. The short of it is the mtx is not what im looking for it sounds great. But i want to be able to make the car shake or damn near with the amp I'm running and i figured using two subs or one crazy sub that are better then that one would do the trick as your all thinking I probaby need a bigger amp b4 getting better subs and I hope I don't cause I just bought the amp lol
what kind of power do you want? geesh 1000 watts RMS is a tremendous amount of power. I have an amplifier in my house rated @ 250 watts RMS x 2 @ 8 ohms, and it'd blow you out of the room with a good set of speakers (in this case, my Martin Logans)
I think you have a bit of a warped idea of jsut how much power you need to drive a sub. The Fi SSD will do just fine with 500-800 watts RMS. The RE SX would as well. The Type R doesn't need any more than 500 watts RMS at the most. With the amp you have, you could get a pair of 4 ohm Type R 12" subs and wire them in parallel for a 2 ohm load and have a terrific setup If you want good output, put them in a ported box with about 2cu ft each, 4" ID ports, tuned to 30Hz. You'll love the response.
heh yeah i think my mind is still trying to get the scope of power ratings and whats really needed i had a look at your site about power ratings and what not on rms and peak but still need to read more stuff on it but i think im down to two sub brands im gonna either go dual 12inch alpine Type Rs the new ones as they seem better then the old ones or dual RE SXX Series they say rms is 1000 per sub but what you wrote about makes me think that my amp could still power them decently toss me some feed back on those REs and if those are a no go i will grab the alpines as they are pretty cheap and will still be a improvment
dont forget to make a good box for them not some pre fab off the shelf. You can have the best subs but a crappy box an itll sound awful but you could also take a crappy sub an build a nice box an make it sound amamzing all depends.
yeah box and install is important. as important as the subs themselves, if not more so.
that said, in regards to power for subs vs power of amp, let me see if I can simplify this: speakers have two power ratings: pak, and continuous (RMS is the wrong term to use for a speaker, but companies do it anyway) power ratings of a speaker are a thermal measure in watts, of how much heat the coil in the speaker can handle without damage. You can typically get an amp up to about 50% more powerful (RMS) than the speaker's continuous power handling without damaging the speaker in a daily driver setting. The reason for that is because power ratings on amplifiers (RMS) are measured with a dummy load, and white noise at full output. In a car, with music, and connected to speakers, an amplifier will never see it's "full" output. Also the amplifier's power output decreases as the volumb of the stereo decreases, again lessening the power to the speakers greatly.
With that out of the way, keep in mind you can NOT damage a speaker by under-powering it. The only way to do so is to turn the gain on the amplifier up too high to compensate for having an amplifier without enough power, resulting in clipping which will damage a speaker. If the amp is set up properly, and gain is set right, no damage will happen from a 500 wat amp driving a 1000 watt speaker.
Now, you have 1 kilowatt @ 2 ohms with the Alpine. (assuming you have the electrical system to handle that much current in your car.) The Alpine Type R and the RE SXX are both really nice subs. If you build a ported box for either choice, use slot ports, or 4" ID ports, and tune the box to say, 28-32Hz range, with about 2 cu ft per sub, I think you'll really be impressed with the result.
Which sub you choose is of course, up to you and your taste and budget.
PS, the only rating for power that ever, ever matters on an amplifier is the RMS or continuous rating. never pay attention at all to the max, peak, PMPO, or similar ratings. They are momentary measurements, and there is no standardization for those tests. There is no way to know how they were measured, and under what conditions. They are as close to a fictitious number as you can get.
RMS power can be measured and often is, by using ISO/IEEE or CEA2006 standardized means, so that companies across the board can be compared to one another, with similar results. This way, Pioneer uses the same set of tests as Alpine, as Sundown, as Audioque, etc.
Ok thank you all for your help I have one last thing I need help with in regards to the enclosure. When making the box is it fine to make the box deeper with less width but still have the same cu ft with the ports or does that make a diff? I will probably make a slotted port enclosure and have a dividing wall between each sub
the only thing for dimensions to keep in mind is that you typically want half the driver's diameter (6" for a 12" sub for example) between the back of the magnet and the far wall of the box, and between the inner edge of the port tube or slot wall, and the opposing panel as well. That considered, make the box any shape that suits the vehicle and your tastes.
Also if you want a good calculator, go to www.bcae1.com and on the right menu, find "basic enclosure calculators" and go to that page. Outstanding java calculators for sealed and vented boxes.
^ Bass is non-directional. You can use a box that's really long & wide, and like 5" high, it doesn't matter. However, proper driver loading does require the back of the magnet to be so far away from the back wall for the cone to be able to move somewhat freely. Using a 12" sub, there usually isn't 6" from all outer walls in a trunk. That's a huge box - 24.5 x 24.5 x 24.5? 6.59 cubes, way too much for a 12".
INside the box, you need 6" beteeen the magnet on the speaker, and the opposing wall of the enclosure, and you need 6" without obstruction between the end of a port tube and opposing cabinet interior wall, and exterior end of port tube and anything obstructing the port (a car interior panel, seat back, etc.)
with a 12" sub, you need 6" of unobstructed space between each end of the port, and anything else.. opposing panel, trunk wall, whatever. You sldo esnt 6" between the back of the sub and the opposing interior surface inside the enclosure. you don't want the magnet structure pressed right up against the back side of the box inside.
just giving a update on the subs ok so i bought the RE SX 12 inch subs they came in the mail and me and my friend just finished the box tonight and installed it all got it at around 2cubic feet per sub and tuned to round 31hertz and all i gotta do is break em in now (box fix with some slight cutting of some sheet metal) and once again thanks for all your help its a great setup now will try to get some pics up soon
You can always try and find a set of Audiobahn Immortals...I know they don't make them anymore they were way ahead of their time when they came out...they were even outlawed in car audio competitions due to unfair advantage over all the other subs....these were the best subs ever made....