Speaker for Bryston set-up

 

Bronze Member
Username: Asimov

Post Number: 17
Registered: May-05
I'm back to my hobby again, this time I've made a big leap and decided to go for Bryston. 20 years warranty is a big deal for me and I've only two options to choose between, Accuphase or Bryston ..... I liked Bryston.
Ordered BP-26 +MPS2, 3B SST2, BDA-1, 2 pairs Bryston XLR cable, Bryston speaker cable & BR-2 remote.
Now I only need a pair of speaker to complete the setup.
I'm considering Dynaudio Confidence C-1, Usher BE-718 DMD & PMC- TB2i Signature.
PMC has proven synergy with Bryston but I'm more inclined towards Dynaudio but my room size is only 11feet x 14 feet, without acoustic treatment would it be overwhelming in my room?

Out of the above three I could have the chance to audition only Usher, if I like the presentation chance would be there to like Confidence C-1. In Stereophile review of Usher 718 BE they compare it with Confidence C-1 ..... more alike but Confidence is better.
Dear Inmates .... would you please enlighten me with your insight to choose me the right speaker considering my room size and if you have better alternative other than those, pl. don't hesitate to recommend.
Oh!! by the way I listen to various genre of music ... mostly instrumentals, classic rock, Jazz, New age, World, Fusion, Ethnic etc.
Hope I will get some useful suggestion while waiting for the gadgets to arrive .... two weeks !!! seems a very long time for me.
THX!!
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 15418
Registered: May-04
.

How would you describe the "Bryston sound"?
 

Bronze Member
Username: Asimov

Post Number: 18
Registered: May-05
"How would you describe the "Bryston sound"?"

That's a tough question for me Jan

My dealer, a very nice guy, took me to his friends house and we got two setup there ... Accuphase pre-power (P-7100) with Usher Be-10, to me the setup was not optimal, BE-10 needs proper space to breath but the space was narrow and the sound I head was lack the snap and attack and highly sibilant and I totally disappointed by Accuphase and Usher presentation.
Then we switch back to Accuphase Pre+Bryston 7BSST (not squared version) driven by PMC IB2 ... now the music got the "soul" ...... I don't know what is meant by "slow" sound but while comparing the two Bryston+PMC seems more fast and got the attack and snap, may be I was hearing the PRAT. The sound was more open and airy and bigger stage than Accuphase+Usher. I was convinced and happy to choose Bryston as price is almost half than Accuphase.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 15425
Registered: May-04
.

Then I'd say buy some PMC's. It's impossible to tell you what you might prefer if you really have no idea what it is you want. IMO, you should have at least three well defined qualites to the music that you cannot live without. You should be able to state these without hestitation and then proceed to a few less essential but desired qualities. Then you should have a list of values you either do not want or can live without in preference to other traits.


.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 15426
Registered: May-04
.

Asimov, do you have such a list already in your head?
 

Bronze Member
Username: Asimov

Post Number: 19
Registered: May-05
Actually I'm waiting for Usher BE-718 DMD to arrive first at my dealer's place then I will get an idea what I'll get from Confidence C-1.
PMC's top of the line IB2 sounds good to me but not so convincing to go for PMC. I had an audition with entry level Dynaudio Audience 42 and I was convinced but failed get one at that time and I'm expecting same sonic signature from C-1 but few step ahead of Audience-42.
I thought some of my inmates would come up and give a comparative analysis between Usher Be-718 DMD and Dynaudio Confidence C-1.
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Stamford, Connecticut USA

Post Number: 4046
Registered: May-05
I haven't heard either speaker, so no comment.

Bryston is pretty transparent. They'll do an excellent job at revealing what they're fed and will allow most speakers to do the same. Synergy will make or break a system IMO, but it's far easier to achieve it with Bryston due to it's transparency IMO. I honestly think it comes down more to what the speaker demands from a power standpoint - the 3B will drive most any speaker out there except the most absurdly designed ones - your room, and your preferences in a speaker's strengths. Bryston will allow the speaker to sink or swim.

Here's a run down of my priorities -
PRaT - If this is missing, the gear is worthless to me.
Tone - It needs to sound natural
Imaging/soundstaging - If I'm hearing everything coming from 2 boxes or all the sound is behind the front plane of the speakers, I pass. I can deal with the "wall of sound" types, but I know it would get old over the long haul.

With these in mind, I prefer (in no particular order) -
Audio Physic - Every model has these qualities in spades IMO.

PMC - Fast paced, huge sound, very clear and articulate. A bit less 3-D sounding than Audio Physic for the most part. AP and PMC aren't that much different side by side.

ATC - Honest studio sound that does everything extremely well so long as you have a monster amp behind them, enough space, and play them a bit on the louder side. Don't look above the SCM 19 with a 3B IMO. Under the right conditions, ATCs sound magical. With anything less than perfect conditions, they're a dull and bland speaker that's very forgettable. ATCs are probably my favorite speaker regardless of price, but they're nearly impossible to live with due to their needs.

Totem - Every model is different. Don't assume that the next model up in price will be an imporvement. They can be hit or miss. I really like the Arro.

Just my opinions and tastes. B&W is a very popular pairing with Bryston as well. They sound great together, but they don't have that PRaT I need, which is an automatic disqualifier for me.
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Stamford, Connecticut USA

Post Number: 4047
Registered: May-05
In an 11x14 room, I'd scratch ATC off the list I made. Not enough room to crank them a bit to open them up and make them shine.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 15497
Registered: Dec-04
How is the sax sounding?
If the setup can't do a tenor sax, then it misses.

Again to follow Jan's 3, where does the tenor saxiphone fall?

Piano?

Vocals? (If you do vocals).

JV's point is to pick the most important bits of playback that you love.
Always accentuate the positive, not correct the negatives.
 

Gold Member
Username: Hawkbilly

Nova Scotia Canada

Post Number: 1059
Registered: Jul-07
Priorities for me.....

- Ease. The music has to flow, unforced, natural, balanced. Nothing sticking out, nothing missing. Most systems I've heard don't pass this first test.
- Tone. Instruments and voices sound natural, with the subtle harmonics and energy present. Midrange instruments are a must, but I can live with some comprises in the extreme frequencies.
- Dynamics. A lot of the expression and emotion in the music is in the subtle ebb and flow in the playing of the musicians. Many systems flatten this out, and the result is rather unengaging. I can compromise on the huge swings, like on large percussion instruments, and large orchestras, etc. But the micro dynamics of a piano, saxophone, guitar, etc must be there.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 15429
Registered: May-04
.

Yes, but not necessarily three different instruments. IMO all instruments are "difficult to reproduce", selecting one over the other isn't telling me anything much about the music. Yeah, a piano needs to "sound like a piano" - which piano? in what room? with which microphone or microphones? - but what's a piano sound like until someone's touching it? Listen to the "Emma" disc and you'll hear three very different impressions of a piano in three different rooms with three different players and recordists. Which one "sounds like a piano"? Do the other two not? Then how does that piano respond to the player's touch and intent? Llke any other instrument a great piano/sax/guitar draws your attention when played while a less good instrument is not so inclined to make music for the less talented player. Give Horwitz and Billy Joel the same piano in the same space, what's the piano sound like? Give them each different pianos in different rooms, what do the players sound like?

One thing about a voice is you know it must nowdays go through a microphone and some electronics. If the vocalist is swallowing a cardiod dynamic mic, then that will sound very different than a vocalist a foot or so from a condenser mic no matter the pick up pattern on the condenser. In most cases, even with "live" music, you're going to hear the vocalist through a microphone and an amplifier/speaker. What's that chain of transducers coupled to an amplifier telling you about a voice? Maybe how a vocalist forms words and uses phrases to convey a meaning and intent, a tension and a release. But hardly what that voice sounds like without the system. IMO there are qualities of a voice, any voice, which are consistent between a recorded voice and someone speaking in your room but the numerous differences are far more dramatic. One thing to notice though is the "size" of the voice, a vocalist speaking in your room should have a very narrowly focussed source - a point source joined to the room sound but a point source to start. That's where you start with comparisons to a recorded voice as that quality can only change if either the recording or the system/room screws with it.

I think I played the Ernest Tubb Record Shop recording last time you were here, Nuck. Now there's a group of players - mostly old timers who grew up making recordings as that one was, with everyone playing at the same time and the vocalist standing away from a mic upright on a stand. You hear the significant difference between the "height", size and tone of those voices and the voices of the "modern" vocalist who stands very close to the mic and produces a very dry sound which is then manipulated in the studio to add some "depth" (not dimensionally, tonally) and some electronic room sound. Same with the Sun Studios mono Elvis, you hear him work the microphone rather than just be in front of the microphone - because how Elvis moved was how the music went - and you hear the reflections from the walls, ceiling and floor to provide a prespective of a space even though the recording is in mono. I still consider that recording - not the "Fever" recording though that has the same advantages except in stereo - to be one of the most realistic in my collection. It tells me quite a bit about how my system is doing as I make any changes.


.
 

Silver Member
Username: Kbear

Canada

Post Number: 796
Registered: Dec-06
I agree with Stu when he says PMC is very clear and articulate. Never did music seem to be mashed together when I heard the TB2i, it was really easy to follow each line in the music. And the transmission line produces really great bass. Deep and impactful but definitely not overdone. The SEAS tweeter produces the nicest highs I've heard from a silk dome.

My demo of the Audio Physic Yara Evolution floorstander this year was disappointing. I only heard it for about five or ten minutes. I think it was a set up issue. I'm not sure if they had enough room to breathe, or if it was the associated gear (they were powered by a Pathos tube amp). The sound was very bloated and hazy. But I do believe it was a set up issue of some sort, because the user reviews online are overwhelmingly positive. So if you can hear a pair you should definitely give them a shot.

One day I will have to listen to a pair of Arros. I keep reading how magical they are.

My favorite speakers thus far are probably the PMC TB2i and Quad 12L2 (fast, detailed, highly resolving, deep and full bass, smooth but not as smooth as the PMC highs, and bit of a recessed mid range. Plus, I find they soundstage well left to right and have nice depth, but do not really put much in front of the speakers...I've gotten used to this...perhaps with a different amp the results would be different). I think it is likely that my Tannoy DC6 will be added to that list, but I haven't had a chance to hear them yet (still waiting for my new stands). I've never heard a pair of poor sounding Tannoys though.
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Stamford, Connecticut USA

Post Number: 4049
Registered: May-05
Interesting about the Yara towers, Dan. When I demoed the Yara bookshelves and towers, they sounded identical to my ears. The towers seemed to go a few hertz lower, but that could have been my mind telling me that they're towers. I didn't think they were worth the alomst double price of the bookshelves. Neither did the salesman. I heard the Pathos once and didn't care much for it at all. It seemed like a fragile toy that was trying too hard to have that 'tube sound,' whatever that is. I can't recall the speakers or source, so maybe it wasn't the Pathos.

My Yaras have never sounded bloated or hazy. Quite the opposite actually - they're a clean, quick, slightly lean sounding speaker. If they're too close to the back wall, they can sound bloated in the bass, but no moreso than anything else that hasn't been designed to be against a wall.

The Yaras are very similar to the PMC monitors. What mainly differeniated them to my ears is they're more 3D and textured sounding.
 

Silver Member
Username: Kbear

Canada

Post Number: 797
Registered: Dec-06
I'm sure the Yaras sound better than what I heard, Stu. There are so many variables to consider that will change the sound drastically. I was all ready to get rid of my Quads, then found a dealer who (rather than try to sell me speakers), said "try this, try that". And bam! all of a sudden the sound quality improved ten fold. I may not hang onto the Quads long-term, but all of a sudden I've got a really great reference to compare new speakers against.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 15500
Registered: Dec-04
Dan, that seems like a matching or cable issue for the PMC's. I have never heard any bloat from them (usually a Naim setup).
PMC does time coherence (as does Naim) so a different outlook?

The Yara floorstanders (name?) that I heard at my dealer were pretty good, but an owner there says the older version is better for bopping to.
The dealer said nothing. That means agreement for Chad.
 

Silver Member
Username: Kbear

Canada

Post Number: 798
Registered: Dec-06
No bloat from the PMC's, Nuck. Loved the sound every time I heard them. I think you may be mixing them up with my comments about the Audio Physics...which again, I think if I had a chance to play around with them a bit I could get them to sound better to my ears.

I did hear a more expensive set of Audio Physic floorstanders playing, for a very brief period. They sounded sublime.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 15503
Registered: Dec-04
The dealer noted that all of the AP lineup was 8 ohm rated, so as far as a nameplate says, might not be hogs.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Betamax

Canada

Post Number: 96
Registered: May-07
I'm running a Rega Apollo into a B100 SST DA (digital coax) with PMCTB2i's in a similar room size, and it sounds wonderful. The tweeter is a beautiful piece of technology and is the same used on some much higher priced models, so you're getting most of the sound at a fraction of the price.

Are the PMC's the best for you and your room? Don't know, but I can't imagine you'd be anything but happy with the sound.

I've been on an upgrade path after getting back into this hobby a few years ago, but with this gear (acquired in the last 6 mths) I'm done upgrading. I should have done like you and just bought Bryston (and PMC) right away. It would have saved me a lot of money to just buy quality first. But I'm there now, and my system sounds great (as good as I need and better than some systems I've heard costing much more), and now I'm just enjoying the music.

Also, be sure to check out the Bryston forum at Audio Circle:
http://www.audiocircle.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=mt08drf90dbbff9dk86jdr8vftvhpepc& board=57.0
 

Bronze Member
Username: Asimov

Post Number: 25
Registered: May-05
Finally I got my gears, at the last moment I made some changes and decided to go for 4BSST2 instead of 3BSST2 as I've ordered for Dynaudio Confidence C1.
Now my system consists of Bryston BP26+4BSS2 & BDA-1 with Bryston XLR cable and Bryston speaker cable.
Rack is custom made, teak wood and 8mm glass and shelves with stainless steel spike. I've to play B&W 602 S3 till the middle of next month, hope I'll get my C1 before new year. But B&W 602 S3 playing at its best.
Upload
 

Platinum Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 13531
Registered: Feb-05
Looks good, Asimov.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Asimov

Post Number: 28
Registered: May-05
Thanks Art, I'm enjoying my music .... just listened Cafe Blue ..... WoW!! what it will be after hooking C1 .....
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Stamford, Connecticut USA

Post Number: 4141
Registered: May-05
That's an excellent system Asimov. I've heard those components with B&W 602s in the past. Not bad at all. But we both know those Dyns will mop the floor with the 602s!
 

Bronze Member
Username: Asimov

Post Number: 49
Registered: May-05
At last I've got my Dynaudio Confidence C-1 along with Dynaudio stand4 and so far there is no issue matching with all Bryston setups.
4BSST2 playing C-1 effortlessly and sound is very impressive for speaker that size ..... no regrets buying C-1.
Now going to order for Bryston BDP-1.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 13850
Registered: Feb-05
Congrats.
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Stamford, Connecticut USA

Post Number: 4327
Registered: May-05
Sounds like a great system, Asimov. I'd really like to hear some feedback on the BDP-1. Not that I'm in the market for it, it really intrigues me.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nickelbut10

Canada

Post Number: 3427
Registered: Jun-07
I want to play with one as well. I dig it.
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Stamford, Connecticut USA

Post Number: 4328
Registered: May-05
That's what she said.

I watch the show The Office way too much!
 

Gold Member
Username: Dmitchell

Ottawa, Ontario Canada

Post Number: 4621
Registered: Feb-07
Damn. That's a nice system! Your dealer must love you.
Jump to: Home Audio Forum | Home Video Forum | Home Theater Forum | Car Audio Forum