BOX BUILDING
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 21 Registered: Nov-04 | I am going to build my own box out of MDF. The subs will be Three 12inch SWR-1241D Alpine Type R's. They will be going in my 2000 Dodge Durango where the third row seat is. Are there any sub box programs out there?? Any ideas??? Thanks |
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BucketNMop Unregistered guest | ported or sealed? You dont really need a program if its sealed. Just build the box to 1cf per chamber...or 3cf common chambered. A program you can get for free (wont make you a CAD rendering or anything) is WinISD Pro from Linearteam.org You have to know what youre doing for that. |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 23 Registered: Nov-04 | I want it sealed... Should I make seperate compartments??? I dont think it will matter since I am running all of this mono so the subs will be going the same way... Am I right about this |
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BucketNMop Unregistered guest | yeah...same amp=common chamber=no worries. you might wanna put some bracing in there to be extra safe, considering the width of 3 subs in a common chambered box. but its up to you there... dude...if you give me max dimensions, ill give you the dimensions of all the boards you need.. but its a lot more fun to do it on your own. GL |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 26 Registered: Nov-04 | Yeah this is gonna be a new experience for me. But I am pretty good at carpentry and lots of friends with tools!!! =) Ill probably do the seperate chambers. Thanks for the help! |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 27 Registered: Nov-04 | Any ideas Damien???? |
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Bronze Member Username: Eric77Post Number: 21 Registered: Nov-04 | Definitely go with seperate chambers. It will give you some bracing and if you blow one sub you wont force the other two to play in too much air, which could harm them. |
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bluntman420 Unregistered guest | i just picked up 2 12" type r's and i bought 2 mrd-m501's...subs rms at 300 as all of you probably know already and the amp says 550x1 @ 2ohm rms...to much power to run mrd-m501 to each sub?.....i already bought them so im gonna run em anyways lol but just wondering if it might be to much? ....thanks... |
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Silver Member Username: JmloughreyFarmington, CT Post Number: 484 Registered: Jul-04 | if you got the dual 4 ohm type r's and you run them at 2 ohms you're gonna break the subs within a few days...550 is way to much for a 300 rms sub to handle, its almost twice the power, 1 MRD M501 would run both subs just fine, not to mention you would need a new alt to run two amps...most likely... |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 40 Registered: Nov-04 | Any "SpecialTools" recommended??? I have a miter saw and a power drill. Plus adhesive and wood screws... Any other recommendations??? |
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Bronze Member Username: Eric77Post Number: 28 Registered: Nov-04 | I dont really know anything about those subs, but on a lot of subs the max rms is much greater than the rcommended rms. Just keep your gains low and you should be fine. |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 49 Registered: Nov-04 | BUMP - Special Tools??? |
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Gold Member Username: GlasswolfNorthWest, Michigan USA Post Number: 6365 Registered: Dec-03 | for building a box? (I didn't read the whole thread) tools I recommend having or having access to anyway: table saw or circular saw speed square torpedo level carpenters' pencils jigsaw cordless drill/driver with paddle bits various clamps scissors utility knife those are the basics. |
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Gold Member Username: GlasswolfNorthWest, Michigan USA Post Number: 6366 Registered: Dec-03 | if you're going to cut port tubes, a chop-saw helps a lot too. (sliding compound mitre saw) just about all of these tools can be found very cheaply on eBay brand new. not the highest quality but if you don't use them daily for professional building, who cares? |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 50 Registered: Nov-04 | Yup got access to it all... Its gonna be a sealed box so no ports are needed |
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Gold Member Username: GlasswolfNorthWest, Michigan USA Post Number: 6370 Registered: Dec-03 | a table saw is really worth it's weight in gold for cutting straight boards with MDF.. long cuts with a circ saw get messy doing it by hand unless you have a very seady eye and hand. Hope it works out well. seal the inside seams using clear silicone and allow it to dry overnight before putting in the subs. I use liquid nails and/or 1.5" coarse thread drywall screws to put the box itself together before sealing it. after it's all together with terminal openings etc cut, then carpet it. 3M Super 77 spray adhesive is teh bomb for automotive carpet. |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 51 Registered: Nov-04 | Cool deal GlassWolf... Ill use your advice. |
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Help2 Unregistered guest | Dont forget the jasper jig and the router  Best tool for cutting big holes by far. |
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New member Username: Trev87Glennville, Georgia Usa Post Number: 8 Registered: Dec-04 | are you making them out of plywood or what cause i plan to make my own ported box and i need to know what the best thing to make it out of would be? |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 53 Registered: Nov-04 | MDF Medium Density Fiberboard |
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Gold Member Username: GlasswolfNorthWest, Michigan USA Post Number: 6420 Registered: Dec-03 | yes MDF. 3/4" |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 57 Registered: Nov-04 | Question... Is there a site that makes sub enclosures that are top notch. Perhaps one that could custom fit three 12 inch subs. I want to do it by myself but if possible I would love for the pro to do it so I do know it is done right. Also I want it too look phenomenal. I have installed many of amps and hu, But I have never built an enclosure... HELP!!! |
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Bronze Member Username: RzarectorCoquitlam, Bc Canada Post Number: 28 Registered: Dec-04 | do it yourself its accually kinda fun once u get going.. just draw it out make sure all the measurements work and all chambers are the same and u can start building.. if you want you can even go to home depo or somewhere and they can cut all the pieces for you at a small cost then u just gotta glue em together and make it look fancy |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 61 Registered: Nov-04 | Yeah, I do want something unique... Just the thought of maybe messing the subs up. I am not that great at math!!! Just dont want to give it too little or too much air space. |
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Silver Member Username: Koz1031Monticello, In United states Post Number: 321 Registered: Jul-04 | I bought one of those box building programs off of ebay. It's pretty cool. It has several different style of boxes you can chose from. It even gives you a cut sheet when you decide what you want, pretty much eliminates any mistakes. If your e-mail is over 3 megs and you'd like to see it, let me know and I'll send it to ya. If you don't like it, you can always delete it. |
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bluntman420 Unregistered guest | i had a friend of mine running the alpine type r 15's which are 500watt rms with 1000watt jl amps to each sub and he never blew a speaker or anything. i know that it is different but i think that if i keep the gain down and run the mrd-m501's that the 12's could handle it...maybe im wrong lol..but i think...any other opinions would be cool..especially one from wolf since he is obviously the most respected person here. no disrespects to anyone else. but give me all of your thoughts if ya know anything....thanks |
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Silver Member Username: JmloughreyFarmington, CT Post Number: 538 Registered: Jul-04 | Koz, if you could email it my way that'd be awsome, i wanna check it out. What program is it? JMLoughrey@aol.com |
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Gold Member Username: GlasswolfNorthWest, Michigan USA Post Number: 6444 Registered: Dec-03 | bluntman, there are a few things to consider here.. first is the enclosure he used. enclosure design will alter power handling of the speaker, raising or lowering it depending on box volume and type. also, the JL puts out 1Kw at full output, but if he never got the amplifier to absolute peak output, he never sent 1Kw to the subs. Remember, every time he decreases uadible volume from full by half, he's using a tenth of the previous amount of power. In simpler terms, every +10dB (audibly twice the volume) takes 10 times more power to produce. At even moderately loud volumes from a system, with the dynamic nature of music, you're usually still only using a small fraction of the amplifier's actual rated power. lastely, the gain setting has no effect at all on the power the amplifier puts out. This is a hard concept to grasp sometimes since the subs get louder and quieter when you change the gain setting, but allow me to try explaining how this works. the amp has a fixed amount of amplification it performs based on the input signal. if the input signal is xx amount, then the output after amplification will be yy. now, if xx is your line voltage from the head unit, and the amplifier's gain is set to match that xx line voltage, then yy will be a nice, clean, loud signal properly amplified. if you turn the gain down below ideal, the yy signal you get out of the amp will be weaker because you're amplifying a signal that's weak to begin with, and thus has more noise, less detail, less resolution, and is just in general very poor.. like trying to hear someone whispering when a sore throat. If the amplifier's gain is set too high on the other hand, the input stage of the amp will be over-driven. when this happens, the amplitude of the xx input signal is over-amplified at the input stage, and instead of being a nice clean sine wave (AC) the signal voltage will exceed the voltage rails of the power supply, and the peaks of the wave will get clipped off, resulting in what looks more like a square wave. now a square wave on a meter looks interesting, sure.. but put this into perspective. we're talking about voltage here. alternating current voltage. when that voltage wave is clipped off flat, it turns in DC voltage. direct current. sending DC voltage to a speaker causes the cone movement to distort so the speaker no longer travels in a linear back and forth motion. When this happens, you get two results. one is the voice coil heats up very quickly, causing thermal damage to the wire wrap voice coils. the second thing is that teh coil, moving in that non-linear way, rubs against the inside of the magnet. when the coil rubs, the fine wire used to make the coil gets worn, and breaks. then your speaker cone freezes up, and your sub is "blown." so, in summary, gain on an amplifier is meant to match your line voltage to the amplifier's input stage, and not meant as a volume control or power adjustment for the amplifier. There is only one proper position for the "gain" knob in a given system, so setting the gain correctly is important. This is a very overlooked and misunderstood topic in car audio, for all of the articles written about it. I hope this has helped clear up some of those misunderstandings for anyone reading this who didn't already know. |
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Gold Member Username: GlasswolfNorthWest, Michigan USA Post Number: 6445 Registered: Dec-03 | hey koz, if ya get time, send that s/w here too. I'd enjoy taking a look at it and seeing what it can do. my email is linked right off my website in my profile. |
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bluntman420 Unregistered guest | wow..lol....im definitely not that advanced. but you did clear my question up..but what do you think about me running 1 mrd-m501 to each of the 2 12" type r's?..any tips you have that might make it a little more safe to run them?...tyvm for your help and it is greatly appreciated. |
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CJH Unregistered guest | hey koz, could u hook me up with that program? |
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Anonymous | my friend runs 2 type r 12's on a memphis1500d which is around 750 rms each.And man do these things hit.They used to be on a 250x2 and he barely hit 140 now hes averaging 143-146.Box is ported 1.3cf each and this is not a rare case ive seen alot of type r's running around 500rms all day long.you should be fine. |
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Silver Member Username: Koz1031Monticello, In United states Post Number: 323 Registered: Jul-04 | CJH if u want that I need an e-mail address. Glass and Jeff I'll get that out either tonight or in the morning. just to let you guys know it comes in 2 seperate e-mails. One is just the decomprsion file. Some need some don't The other is the program itself. It has a bunch of different subs already in it, with all needed numbers, plus the fact that you can add any that you want. It also has the capability of cojmparing up to three different boxes to see which works best for you. Now for the bad part. Since I'm doing something for you guys You guys need to do something for me. HAVE A GREAT AND SAFE HOLIDAY!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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Bronze Member Username: Crazy3rdgenLong Neck, Delaware U.s Post Number: 74 Registered: Sep-04 | yeah what program should i use for port box building |
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Silver Member Username: Koz1031Monticello, In United states Post Number: 324 Registered: Jul-04 | OK guys (exceptCJH)I got that stuff sent to you guys this morning. If it doesn't show up let me know and I'll try it again. |
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Bronze Member Username: SlimSt.pete, Florida Post Number: 93 Registered: May-04 | koz can u send it to me also |
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Silver Member Username: SolacedagonyNew Jersey US Post Number: 139 Registered: Oct-04 | If you feel like sending it to me as well, Koz, that'd be appreciated. arsonicconvergen@hotmail.com Thanks, you have a great holiday as well! |
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luverboy Unregistered guest | if you thick that that is going to work u r stupid all u guys are stupid. fu^k u all |
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Bronze Member Username: Mr_keboAlbertville, Al USA Post Number: 91 Registered: Nov-04 | Hey koz. think you could hook me up with that nifty little program. My Email is Kebo18@gmail.com |
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Silver Member Username: Koz1031Monticello, In United states Post Number: 328 Registered: Jul-04 | in this time of peace on earth, we get a guy like luverboy. But then his name says it all. BOY |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 67 Registered: Nov-04 | Haha... Boys... |
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Bronze Member Username: WojoproPost Number: 67 Registered: Nov-04 | Haha... Boys... |
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Bronze Member Username: Trev87Glennville, Georgia Usa Post Number: 26 Registered: Dec-04 | hey just out of curiosity is there anything wrong with making a box out of plywood? does it make the speaker sound bad or anything.whats wrong with plywood? |
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Bronze Member Username: RzarectorCoquitlam, Bc Canada Post Number: 34 Registered: Dec-04 | plywood flexes alot and thats no good |
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Bronze Member Username: AvalanchePost Number: 75 Registered: Nov-04 | Hi Guys KOZ if you would not mind may I also have a copy of this program. I would greatly appreciate it and happy holidays to you too and everyone here. hland61@hotmail.com |
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Gold Member Username: GlasswolfNorthWest, Michigan USA Post Number: 6552 Registered: Dec-03 | trevor, ideally, you want an enclosure not to flex at all. flexing in the box not only colors the sound by altering the volume, but it also means a loss of energy that would otherwise translate into more volume, making the box less efficient. plywood not only has a grain, which lends it to more flexing, but it's generally not thick or strong enough to resist flexing from the pressures exerted on the material by the speakers. the best material for a box, given price, weight, ease of workability, etc.. is 3/4" MDF (medium density fiberboard.) It's about $18 for a 4x8' sheet, and has no grain so cutting the board is much easier. Especially when you get into more complex enclosures where you have to deal with tight angles or curves. |
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Unregistered guest | Hey everyone, im new to all this car audio stuff but im tryin to read up on things to gain a little knowledge. I read all your comments and everyone was great. I think i have gained enough knowledge to at least make it seem like i know what im talking about,,lol. But Koz, and im sure your getting extreamly sick of sending it, but could you send me that program? I would like to check it out. If you could that would great. My email is avike4evr4@hotmail.com. Again thanks to everyone who posted stuff. TTYL Big Al |
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Bronze Member Username: TerminatermuleAustralia Post Number: 60 Registered: Nov-04 | Hey guys, I would like a copy of that program as I going to try and build a custom box for my car. I have something i can offer in exchange though, I can give you guys some space and access to one of my servers so you can put bits and pieces like this on there. If any of you are interested then give me a hoy. Koz if you could be bothered a copy of the program to glenn@finalfrontera.nq.nu would be awesome. Cheers Glenn |
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Silver Member Username: JmloughreyFarmington, CT Post Number: 588 Registered: Jul-04 | Koz, hope its cool but i sent it out to em, thought you'd be tired of asking, if its not cool, sorry man... |
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Bronze Member Username: UdaiPost Number: 25 Registered: Dec-04 | If its not too much trouble can you send it to me too : magicalmonkey18@yahoo.com ill send it out as well if you want merry christmas HOHOHO ;\ |
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big al Unregistered guest | thanks jeff and koz i guess lol |
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Silver Member Username: Koz1031Monticello, In United states Post Number: 335 Registered: Jul-04 | Jeff; Thanks for the help, just wondering what anybody thinks of it. The link zac put up yesterday seems to be pretty helpful also. I like the idea of just filling in the numbers, and click you got the sq ft of the box. even with a calculator, that's the 1 thing I hate the most. ok guys I got magicalmonkey and sending this to him in just a few. |
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Bronze Member Username: Eric77Post Number: 38 Registered: Nov-04 | If you guys dont mind I would love to check out that software, My emails eadington@gmail.com Thanks |
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Big Al Unregistered guest | yea i cant get this thing to work for some reason.. just wondering if anyone had the same problem.. thanks Big Al |
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Bronze Member Username: Crazy3rdgenLong Neck, Delaware U.s Post Number: 79 Registered: Sep-04 | What PROGRAM should i use in building ported boxs? |
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Bronze Member Username: Crazy3rdgenLong Neck, Delaware U.s Post Number: 80 Registered: Sep-04 | What PROGRAM should i use in building ported boxs? |
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Gold Member Username: GlasswolfNorthWest, Michigan USA Post Number: 6665 Registered: Dec-03 | who needs a program for a simple ported box? there are port calculators all over the web. google for one, or try the ones on bcae1.com or the12volt.com |
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Silver Member Username: Koz1031Monticello, In United states Post Number: 339 Registered: Jul-04 | Big Al; E-mail me at koz1031@msn.com with whatever problem you are having with that, and I'll see if I can help you out. You may have to be a little patient, I work 6 dys a wk 12 hrs a day, and the only time I have on this thing is basically a couple of hours in the 4to6 am area in the mornings. and that's not everyday. But I'm pretty sure we can get you going on it. If I can get anybody can. If you get into the help files, it pretty well explain things. |
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