Like

Technical Question - Arcam AVR300 power ratings

 

Audiofreak
Unregistered guest
Listed on the technical specs with regards to the Arcam AVR300.

"Meets rated 100 WPC continous power output into both 4 and 8 ohms, all 7 channels driven simultaneously at 1khz"

"Stereo output power over 120WPC into 4 or 8 ohms, 20hz-20khz"

Some amateur questions.....

a). Wouldn't measuments at 20hz - 20khz be more accurate compared to 1hz?

b). If that is the case, can the Arcam still deliver deliver 100watts x 7channels continously?

c). Why do they measure 7channels at 1hz and stereo at 20hz-20khz?

Could someone shed some light on this subject?
 

Gold Member
Username: Kegger

MICHIGAN

Post Number: 1368
Registered: Dec-03
all manufacturers rate their power differently. i
can't tell you why arcam does it that way.

but the arcam is going to be closer to it's rated
power per all channels than most recievers.
it's one heck of a unit!
 

Silver Member
Username: Geekboy

Newport, RI United States

Post Number: 375
Registered: Dec-03
Audiofreak: Kegger is right, the Arcam is a nice unit to have.

To answer your questions directly...

a). Wouldn't measuments at 20hz - 20khz be more accurate compared to 1hz?

They would certainly be more real world, but clearly just stating "accurate" wouldn't be fair. Some of the manufacturers test both ways. They test at 1KHz as well as 20Hz-20KHz (white noise). The 1KHz test is required by the United States Department of Commerce's Federal Trade Commission (aka the FTC). This way, they can say they adhere to the law. The most important thing you can gather from the Arcam's spec is the all 7 channels driven simultaneously. That's what's most important.

b). If that is the case, can the Arcam still deliver deliver 100watts x 7channels continously?

Again, read my answer to your question "a". The Arcam clearly states all 7 channels driven simultaneously. I would be concerned only Arcam did not state that. Usually, the manufacturers trying to hide their power ability under stress will then go about listing pairs of speakers (L/R, Center, RR/RL) with their power. (As an aside: I notice that the new H/K x30 line is listing the power by these groupings as well. They are clearly trying to do something... adhere to the FTC's wishes? I don't know, but it's odd.) The Arcam will do very close to 100W x 7, but not 100W x 7 with 20Hz-20KHz. The difference, however, is usually very slight, unless the power supply is really bad. This will not be the case in the Arcam!

c). Why do they measure 7channels at 1hz and stereo at 20hz-20khz?

First, the test is done at 1KHz, not 1Hz. (That would be a difficult test to pass for anyone at 1Hz!). Because the power handling at 1KHz is going to be different than at 20Hz-20KHz. Quite simply, almost all of these receivers today, even the low end Sony junk, will do over 100W in Stereo with 20Hz-20KHz sent through both channels. The problem with the power supplies is high current capability. These poor power supplies just cant supply that kinda wattage to each of 7 speakers (or even 5 in most test cases), at the same time. It's very easy to drive a speaker -- or two -- at 1KHz. It's a much different story to drive multiple (5+) speakers from 20Hz-20KHz at the same time.

The lower frequencies require more power to produce higher SPLs. So, essentially cutting off the test at the "bass" (lower) end of the frequency range, you have effectively lessened the load on the amplifier so it doesn't clip as soon (or go into protection). This means the load is easier to drive, and hence you get a nice number like Sony's STR-DE995 of 110W x 7... when it can't even do 38W x 5 all channels drivens (20Hz-20KHz). :-)

Sorry, that's my pet peeve with these manufacturers.

For tests of multi-channel (home theater) receivers, please visit the Sound and Vision Test Reports at Audio.eRobinson.NET.
 

New member
Username: Spoonfed

Post Number: 2
Registered: Sep-04
looks better to have 100w x 7 with (at 1khz in bracket) to the "un-knowing" than what it is 20-20k....... which one be pretty sure is less than a 1khz......... 80w mabye?
 

Silver Member
Username: Geekboy

Newport, RI United States

Post Number: 379
Registered: Dec-03
Dan, I don't understand your question. The more realistic test -- although it too isn't a perfect scenario -- is a system tested at 20Hz-20kHz. The 20Hz-20kHz represents the full spectrum of audible material (with some subsonic and supersonic frequencies).

It mostly has to do with the power capabilities of the power supply and amplifier section over what frequencies the receiver can reproduce.
 

GPB
Unregistered guest
I am considering purchase of the AVR300, but my questions about their specs has to do with the power output at both 4ohms and 8ohms --it's the same (100w/channel) for both. How is this possible? I thought a really good amp would nearly double it's output from 8 ohms to 4 ohms. What am I missing?
 

New member
Username: Spoonfed

Post Number: 3
Registered: Sep-04
HiFi News (AV Tech's) tests of the AVR300 (in their AVR comparo....interestingly the AVR300 didn't fair to well)

7 x 115w into 8 ohms
7 x 45w into 4 ohms

on 4 ohm switch
7 x 80 into 8 ohms
7 x 120w into 4 ohms

Dynamic output 115w(8ohm) 195w(4ohm) 40w(2ohm)

They dynamic ability seems the worst in the test..... i an example the HK AVR630 was 145w, 243w and 350w into 8,4,2ohm........ the pioneer 480watt into 2 ohm!

I decided against the AVR300 as it was too pricy for me given the performance improvement i saw.
Seems on the above review for sound quality the Rotel RSX1056 then 3805 is better option.... having demoed both the 3805 and AVR300.... i feel they are close.

Though my new receiver while a little lacking in comparison in 5.1........ in 2ch feed digital it is noticably better than AVR300....
oh its a panasonic also :-) heheh
XR45.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Mgkaplan

Calabasas, CA USA

Post Number: 80
Registered: Mar-04
Here is a site that will give you the power ratings on the AVR 300:
http://www.aslgroup.com/arcam/AVR300PowerRatings.pdf

Have you listened to the ARCAM? The sound is awesome. In fact my dealer says that since the Arcam AVR300 has been introduced, many customers who would otherwise be purchasing higher end separates are now purchasing the ARCAM.

You would best be served by doing a side by side test.
 

New member
Username: Spoonfed

Post Number: 4
Registered: Sep-04
Yeah the "figures" seem to alter depending whom does the test...... though your link refers to the manufacturers OWN tests :-) haha.... not that i don't trust Arcam.... they seem very helpful.

Yep i have listened to a AVR300 and also compared to a 3805...... as i said above NEITHER compare to the Panasonic.

My speakers are Quad 12L's
 

Audiofreak
Unregistered guest
Dear All,

Beware! I had an opportunity to listen to the AVR300 using a pair of B&W 704 (stereo mode)(8ohm at 89db sensitivity). I have to crank it up to 82db (100db was the max) before it was decently loud.

Fearing that the 704s could be difficult to drive, I then switch it to a pair of B&W 603s and the results were MARGINALLY better. I have to crank it up to almost 80% to get it to play loud.

In stereo mode, the Arcam AVR300 is supposed to produce 120watts per channel. Which should be more than adequate to drive the 603s. BTW, after 5 minutes, it was running HOT!

To add injury to insult, the dealer was pretty nonchalant about it, "commenting "that the way it is". Go figure!

My own conclusion is that the unit could be faulty or the power supply is inadequate. Comments anyone? I still could not believe that the AVR300 could be that pathetic especially after all the 5 star and rave reviews that I have read. Imagine if all 7 channels are used.....

Anyway, I have decided against the AVR300 as I could not stand the dealer.
 

New member
Username: Spoonfed

Post Number: 5
Registered: Sep-04
To its "defence" (sort of) on this issue.

I noticed the same Driving my Quad 12L's.

Though i also noticed it "seemed" to be able to go to full 100 and stay "clean".... seemed to stil have more in reserve one could not "use".

Can't comment on "hot" the demo i had was faulty and the fans never turned off.

Oh and its not really 80%.. its in dB so every 10db "appears" to be twice as loud..... every 3db needs "twice" the power.
 

MarcUR
Unregistered guest
"Beware! I had an opportunity to listen to the AVR300 using a pair of B&W 704 (stereo mode)(8ohm at 89db sensitivity). I have to crank it up to 82db (100db was the max) before it was decently loud"

if you go over to the arcam avs forum, you will learn that arcam designed the receiver to be this way. They wanted to have exceptional detail at lower listening levels as well as when you drive it hard. They actually have representatives who designed the avr300 answering questions related to arcam products over there. Its one of the better sites I've found on the net.

http://www.avforums.com/frame.html?http://www.avforums.com/forums/showthread.php ?p=1058284#post1058284
 

New member
Username: Spoonfed

Post Number: 6
Registered: Sep-04
The 300 has 3 distinct volume steps..... the first at 84/85 and the second at about 92/93.

I think "maybe" at these steps is "may" ramp up more.... but given its in dB that would be wrong.

The steps are very noticable.... annoyed me a little.
 

Audiofreak
Unregistered guest
Guys,

Thanks for the inputs. At one stage I cranked it up to 85db and it was not ONLY approaching loud. Way off from HT loud. To give you an idea, I could still have a conversation with the dealer with raised voice.

Spoonfield - you were right. It stayed clean even at 82db. But it is the level that I am concerned about. Rather lack of it. BTW, it didnn't sound much louder from 82-85.

Anyway, have decide to go for a Rotel 1068/1095 combination. Awesome!

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »

Facebook

Shop Related Deals

Directory

Main Forums

Today's Posts

Forum Help

Follow Us