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Looking for a new integrated amp

 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13273
Registered: Jun-04
for my nht classic 4's.

Looking for a 250 watt per channel receiver in the 1000 dollar range or less if possible.
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Gold CoastAustralia

Post Number: 2884
Registered: Nov-05
The thread title says looking for an intergrated amp

Your post says looking for a reciever

What is it you are looking for?
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13275
Registered: Jun-04
opps typo I meant integrated amp
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Gold CoastAustralia

Post Number: 2885
Registered: Nov-05
I'm not too familiar with US prices but you most likely won't get a great 250 watt amp for that money if you want new.
Any reason you want 250 watts?
What speakers do you have and what are their specs - sensitivity, impedence, recommended power?

And what's your source (s)?
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13278
Registered: Jun-04
Dome Tweeter(s): Yes
Passive Subwoofer: Yes
Four-Way: Yes
Magnetically Shielded: Yes
Floorstanding: Yes
Frequency Response: 27.0 Hz - 20000.0 Hz
Power Output: 250.0 Watts (total)
Nominal Impedance: 6.0 Ohms
Sensitivity (Efficiency): 86.0 dBSPL
Driver Complement: 1 x 10.0", 1 x 6.5", 1 x 2.0", 1 x 0.75"
Dimensions (in.) 7.5 W x 41.0 H x 16.0 D
Weight 64.0 lbs.

nad 372 integrated anp is my source
with a $500 nad cd player forget the model

Actually finding out they are 6 ohm speakers ill probably only need 200 a channel
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 14475
Registered: May-04
.

Why's that?
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13279
Registered: Jun-04
Because it will put out more power at 6 ohms. But if you think I should go 250 I will. I was thinking about a parasound 2250 I found one used for $650
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 14477
Registered: May-04
.

There ya'go, Rantz. You should be able to handle this one.
 

Gold Member
Username: Soundgame

Toronto, Ontario Canada

Post Number: 1111
Registered: Jun-08
The NHT's are high quality speakers - you would do well to feed them high quality power. Don't sweat the power ratings - with a high quality integrated, you don't need a whole lotta whats - it's the current that matters. That said, the NHT's are a little thirsty and will do well with more power.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13286
Registered: Jun-04
another to add to the list

Anthem Integrated 225
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13287
Registered: Jun-04
What would you recommend for them George
 

Platinum Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 12023
Registered: Feb-05
http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?intatran&1270165865&/Krell-KAV-300i

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?intatran&1269989824&/Cambridge-Audio-840A -V1

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?intatran&1269659923&/Anthem-Integrated-22 5

Just a start. Used is about the only way to go.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13306
Registered: Jun-04
Thats fine to go used thats what ive been looking at. Thanks for the links.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13315
Registered: Jun-04
how about a Cairn 4810 added to the list
 

Silver Member
Username: Hawkbilly

Nova Scotia Canada

Post Number: 792
Registered: Jul-07
Recommending strictly on what amp has enough oomph to drive those speakers is only part of the process Sean. You'll need to hear some of these amps or at least understand how they are different from each other and how they align with the sound qualities you are looking for. A Nad, Krell, Anthem, CA or Cairn amp sound quite different from each other.

Do you know what it is you are looking for ?
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13317
Registered: Jun-04
I want an amp that can bring out the bass more and a warm sound but not too bright.
 

Gold Member
Username: Nickelbut10

Post Number: 2963
Registered: Jun-07
Good find Art on those, especially that Anthem. Wow.

Heard the Anthem 225 beast a few times now and it is one powerful, warm, smooth sounding integrated amp. Might be worth an in home try out Sean. At that price, if you don't like it, sell it.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 14514
Registered: Dec-04
From your description and sources, Sean, why not look at NAD amps?
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Irvington, New York USA

Post Number: 3641
Registered: May-05
If you truly need more power (not sure you do though), have you thought about adding an external amp to your integrated?

There are far more 250 watt amps than integrated amps. After a while, sell the integrated amp buy a pre-amp.

Under $1k used, the Adcom 5802 is a 250 watt beast of an amp. I have no idea what you think sounds good, but it sounds good to my ears.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13324
Registered: Jun-04
nuck I have a nad 372 now and its not giving me enough bass
 

Silver Member
Username: Magfan

USA

Post Number: 844
Registered: Oct-07
here we go again.

Not enough bass, eh?
Is the room / speaker setup properly? have you tried moving the speakers closer to a boundary?
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 14516
Registered: Dec-04
right Leo. Or a Krell...
 

Platinum Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 12025
Registered: Feb-05
That is one bass heavy speaker so if you are not getting enough bass it is something other than the speaker. As already mentioned try room setup first...but I think you knew from the start that you would probably need more amp to drive the NHT's.
 

Silver Member
Username: Hawkbilly

Nova Scotia Canada

Post Number: 794
Registered: Jul-07
Are the 4's more difficult to drive than the 3's ? The 3's weren't that difficult a load....unless the real world is quite different than the measurements I've seen for those speakers. The Nad should drive them reasonably well. I'm with Leo.....room first. Try some temporary bass traps in the corners behind the speakers just to see what that does.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 12026
Registered: Feb-05
Yes they are more difficult and the 3's take a hefty amp to drive to their fullest as well. NHT's have always been a speaker that worked best with a powerful amp. I've owned a number of them.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 14520
Registered: Dec-04
I am unfamiliar with them. Can the woofer be parted and driven by an active bass amp?
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Irvington, New York USA

Post Number: 3644
Registered: May-05
Assuming the speaker/room interface isn't at fault, wouldn't a powered subwoofer work far better and cost less?
 

Platinum Member
Username: Artk

Albany, Oregon USA

Post Number: 12027
Registered: Feb-05
I believe it can, Nuck. I haven't looked at the back of one for a while. Jim moved his from the shop to his home and put his Apogees at the shop. The speaker reaches the upper 20's and shouldn't have any problem delivering plenty of bass for music, if the room and amplification is right. It could be that Sean is asking for even more bass and if that is so, I recommend SV subs...when nothing else will do!
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13325
Registered: Jun-04
Ill mess around with room placement first.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 14521
Registered: Dec-04
If the bass driver is isolated and driven by a bass amp of some description, the integration of the bass is much easier to handle. Just a thought.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13326
Registered: Jun-04
I got my new/used integrated amp guys....Parasound HCA-1200 for 343.00 shipped 205 watts per channel at 8 ohms 315 at 4 ohms. My speakers are 6 ohms so I should be good for power.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 14526
Registered: Dec-04
Then work with speaker placement?
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13327
Registered: Jun-04
I figured theres nothing wrong with more power as well. I will also work with speaker placement but the way my apartment is laid out theres not much choice.
 

Silver Member
Username: Magfan

USA

Post Number: 846
Registered: Oct-07
400+ watts @8?
NHT classic 4? =10" 4way?
Not enough bass?
Apartment?

I smell trouble brewing.
Sean, if there's still time, try to convince your poor, long suffering neighbors you are at least partially deaf. That should buy you enough time to rent a house somewhere.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13345
Registered: Jun-04
LOL Im careful....I was using an nad c372 150 x 2 at 8 ohms
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Irvington, New York USA

Post Number: 3650
Registered: May-05
How much louder do you think 205 watts will be than the 150? Do you really think you used close to the 150 watts?

The Parasound amp will sound different. But it won't be much louder.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 14527
Registered: Dec-04
And I know of very few amps with more bass in the house sound then NAD.
 

Silver Member
Username: Hawkbilly

Nova Scotia Canada

Post Number: 798
Registered: Jul-07
Sean, put a couple of sleeping bags behind your NHT's and see what that does. If it sounds better (more bass, fuller) add more....rolled up blankets if you have to....it's only temporary to see if that helps.

You can make it sound louder with more watts, but it won't likely sound better. You either need more USEABLE watts, or speaker placement/room improvements. I can't fathom a speaker needing more than 100w to "sound good".
 

Silver Member
Username: Magfan

USA

Post Number: 849
Registered: Oct-07
All things being equal, which they sure ain't, to get a meaningful increase in loudness, you should go at least 2x the power.

If 'too much is never enough', get a pair of the Bel Canto 500@8 monos.
That kilowatt @8 should translate to over 1400@6.

Start saving for your bail.
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Irvington, New York USA

Post Number: 3654
Registered: May-05
It reminds me of my brother...

We both had identical Volvo 850 Turbos. Very fast cars in a practical sense, believe it or not. He wanted a faster car. My conversation with him -

'Have you ever reached the performance limits of the car, let alone on a regular basis?'

'Nope.'

'What's a faster car going to do if you're not maxing out the car you have now?'
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Gold CoastAustralia

Post Number: 2894
Registered: Nov-05
It's about head room. That extra power can be beneficial with not so easy to drive speakers even if you aren't using all those watts.

The same with cars, even if you don't go the extra speed, the extra torque can be beneficial.
 

Silver Member
Username: Hawkbilly

Nova Scotia Canada

Post Number: 799
Registered: Jul-07
Head room is only useful (to me) if it's good sounding head room. Extra watts for the sake of extra watts only goes louder. I would expect.....and this is just my opinion....that there are plenty of 100w amps that would drive those speakers with relative ease and make them sound darn good in the process. I would even bet that there are 50w or less amps that would as well. There are many more 100w, 200w, 500w, etc amps that will make those speakers go plenty loud, and not sound worth a d@mn.

I'm not arguing that you don't need sufficient power to drive a given speaker to its full potential. I just have difficulty believing that a good 100w amp can't drive MOST speakers to that potential. If he's got a decent amp and it's still not sounding the way he'd like, I'd look for other causes. The power quest may not be very rewarding. JMO.
 

Gold Member
Username: My_rantz

Gold CoastAustralia

Post Number: 2895
Registered: Nov-05
Agreed Chris - there are all sorts of factors to be taken into account - peak to peak voltage and current, damping and so forth. And you are right; a good 100 watt amp should to the job in Sean's case and I can't see what the bass problem would be with his Nad - having had a similar one in the C162/262.
 

Gold Member
Username: Stu_pitt

Irvington, New York USA

Post Number: 3658
Registered: May-05
I understand headroom in the amps and cars. But if you're not using it, what is more going to do?

Most people would be very surprised by how few watts they're using. Track down a McIntosh dealer and watch the watt meters on the front of their amps. 30 watts constant in a normal room with somewhat difficult speakers (B&W 700 series towers for example) is pretty loud. It was a bit louder than my usual listening level. Peaks go up, but not too often, and rarely if ever go more than 100.

Wattage is pretty much a sales literature thing to get you to buy more. There are speakers that need serious wattage to open up and sound right (ATCs and Totem Mani-2s come to mind), but they're pretty few and far between. NHTs are harder to drive than the average speaker, but they're not absurd.

NAD will give plenty of bass quantity. Quality is another thing.
 

Silver Member
Username: Hawkbilly

Nova Scotia Canada

Post Number: 802
Registered: Jul-07
Right on Stu. For the curious, stick a multimeter on the back of one of your speakers when you are playing music at a typical level for you. For me, it's just a few watts. Good thing to, cuz I only have 15 to play with.
 

Silver Member
Username: Kbear

Canada

Post Number: 509
Registered: Dec-06
I was always amazed at the levels my Denon minisystem (30 watts) could drive speakers that had average sensitivity ratings (Energy C-1, Tannoy F2, Wharfedale Evo2-10) in the upper 80's. Though the sound quality wasn't bad at all, it did not compare to the integrated amps that I've tried (from Audiolab and Exposure), which to my ears excelled with dynamics and attack/decay that the Denon had trouble conveying.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Insearchofbass

York, Pennsylvania

Post Number: 13352
Registered: Jun-04
Well for the price I got the new amp for if it doesnt do the job better than the nad c372 i can always sell it.
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