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24bit 96khz audio.... DVD-A or just plain DVD-V?

 

New member
Username: Nestorleone

Buenos AiresArgentina

Post Number: 1
Registered: Aug-09
I'm into listening a lot of 24 bit audio downloaded from the web and also I have ripped some of my old vinyl jewels into my PC at 24bit 96khz.

Now to burn this to disc for storage and listening on my main hi-fi equipment, I thought DVD-A was the way to go. But really got tired searching for software that will do the trick and create nice and easy, from flac or wav files, a clean DVD-A disc.

I got to burn two discs, but found that only winDVD or PowerDVD will plays these discs on my PC, and that my standard Sony DVD Player/Recorder won't read them.

So my question is, creating them as DVD-V with 24b96k audio, will have lesser quality? Or will they mantain the fidelity of the original ripped file ?

Is DVD-A any different from 24B96K DVD ?

thanks!
 

New member
Username: Nestorleone

Buenos AiresArgentina

Post Number: 2
Registered: Aug-09
Well.... browsing the web I came up with this nice response to my problem:

http://www.audioasylum.com/forums/dvda/messages/2/29563.html

What do you guys in this forum think ?
 

Platinum Member
Username: Jan_b_vigne

Dallas, TX

Post Number: 13847
Registered: May-04
.

So what are you asking? Should you transfer your files to a hi-rez format?

Yep! that's one option. But DVD-V is not the same as DVD-A, the codecs are quite different and, as the thread you found points out, the video format is a lossy format with high compression while DVD-A is a lossless format. If you cannot duplicate and playback in the lossless format of DVD-A, then you need some other solution.


.
 

New member
Username: Nestorleone

Buenos AiresArgentina

Post Number: 3
Registered: Aug-09
Yes Jan, I saw that. So, DVD-A is the only way to go it seems, when burning hi-res audio to media.

The main objective of this post was to learn from you guys new about some other way to have 24/96 audio stored, other than DVD-A or the hard drive of a computer.

Thanks Anyway!
 

Silver Member
Username: Arnold_layne

MadridSpain

Post Number: 465
Registered: Jun-04
Oh, DVD-A has become easier to handle nowadays. But first: 2-channel 96/24 DVD-A and DVD-V have exactly the same audio content. The only difference is the MLP lossless compression, which actually is optional as long as total bitrate doesn't exceed 9,6 mbps. One might think that MLP is better because disc read speed is lower and the decompressing implies that jitter is omitted. But I'm not sure that holds in real life.

DVD-Audio Solo and Discwelder are to applications for authoring in-spec DVD-A discs. If you need MLP it gets more complicated. Professional softwares like Surcode are very expensive. Anyway, for stereo, Quad or any 48/24 material you don't need it.

There are also some freewares for PC playback. But they suffer the same downsampling issues as PowerDVD. It's a Windows issue, and difficult to avoid.
 

New member
Username: Nestorleone

Buenos AiresArgentina

Post Number: 4
Registered: Aug-09
So burning 24/96 stereo to DVD-V is just the same as burning to DVD-A? Perfect then.

You talked about the problem of downsamplig when playing-back, If I use a 24/96 capable sound card, why does this happen ? or doesn't ? I suppose that if I use a software that decodes 24/96 audio and a 24/96 capable sound-card this shouldn't happen.

My main concern anyway, besides burning the media i have in 24/96 stereo, is that sometime in the future I want to listen to it on my iPod, and as the iPod now playback 24/48 stereo audio - and it won't be long till 24/96 or even 24/192 be playable on these devices - I want to know how can I rip it easier.

I've seen that DVD Audio Extract is a great software, but it only works for DVD-V discs. I tried it on DVD-A and it doesn't recognize them.

So for now, my best option would be to:

1 - Burn to 24/96 stereo to DVD-V
2 - Listen to the disc on any universal DVD player at 24/96 (is this possible ?)
3 - Rip the 24/96 audio with DVD Audio Extract into apple looseless to have the 24/48 audio in my iPod.

I'm just trying to have full quality audio through a simple process.

}}
 

New member
Username: Nestorleone

Buenos AiresArgentina

Post Number: 5
Registered: Aug-09
LPlex : http://audioplex.sourceforge.net (as described in the previous post) used to create the DVD-V .iso image with 24/96 audio. then burned with NERO or any DVD burning software.

DVD Audio Extract : http://www.castudio.org/dvdaudioextractor/index.php for extracting the audio from a DVD-V at 24/96.

Illustrate dbPowerAmp : http://www.dbpoweramp.com/ used for converting almost any audio format to any audio format, easy and conveniently.
 

Platinum Member
Username: Nuck

Post Number: 13168
Registered: Dec-04
Good stuff, Nestor! thanks

Beautiful women and awesome steaks are not the only good things to come from BA.
 

New member
Username: Nestorleone

Buenos AiresArgentina

Post Number: 7
Registered: Aug-09
LOL Nuck!!!! you're right. There are many good things around here.
 

Gold Member
Username: John_a

LondonU.K.

Post Number: 4822
Registered: Dec-03
DVD-A. The audio is written and read using files that are encoded in linear PCM (Pulse Code Modulation). This is the same method of encoding as on an audio CD. However, CD carries 16-bit samples read at a frequency of 44.1 kHz. DVD-A, in contrast, can have any one of a number of different sample sizes and sampling frequencies, and these can go beyond the limits of CD and so can in principle give better resolution of detail in recorded sound. A two-channel stereo DVD-A can have 24-bit samples read at 48 kHz, 96 kHz, or 192 kHz. Also unlike CD, DVD-A can have more than two channels (for example 5.1), in which case the maximum sampling frequency falls to 96 kHz. DVD-A specification allows one form of file compression, but it is not obligatory. This is called MLP for Meridian Lossless Packing. It is lossless, merely reducing file size without losing information.

DVD-V carries audio in any one of a number of different formats. The most common is Dolby Digital, also called AC-3. This is a compressed, lossy format designed for 5.1 channel surround sound, but can of course be in 2-channel stereo or single-channel mono. An alternative to Dolby Digital is DTS for Digital Theater Systems. It has 5.1 channels only and is based on PCM (like CD and DVD-A) with an added compression. Some DVD-V disks also carry audio in two-channel uncompressed linear PCM, called variously PCM, LPCM, or PCM Stereo. Only in this last case is the format the same as that on certain sorts of DVD-A (the two-channel sort without MLP).

This is my understanding. Hope it helps.
 

New member
Username: Nestorleone

Buenos AiresArgentina

Post Number: 8
Registered: Aug-09
Fantastic explanation. Thank you very much John!!!!

So then, if I didn't missunderstood, burning a DVD-V with PCM data is like using a DVD-A with the same format, right? No loss of information happens.
 

Gold Member
Username: John_a

LondonU.K.

Post Number: 4823
Registered: Dec-03
Thanks, Nestor! Yes, I think that's right - burn a DVD-V with PCM data and, on the resulting disk, the audio from the PCM track is the same as it would be on a 2-channel DVD-A disk. Of course, you still only get the resolution that is in the audio file you started with. Also, you may have to go to the settings on the DVD player and make sure it can read the PCM audio data on the DVD-V disk.

Then there is a difference between DVD-A and DVD-V in the way the files are organized, and what they are called, on the disk.

DVD Audio content is stored in a separate zone on the disc (the AUDIO_TS directory) whereas DVD video discs store the video along the associated audio in the VIDEO_TS directory.

That is from Linn Records

Burning downloaded music onto DVD-A.

I've downloaded some of their "Studio Master" recordings (up to 24 bit, 192 kHz) but not yet tried burning them to DVD in any form, except to back up the files.
 

Gold Member
Username: John_a

LondonU.K.

Post Number: 4824
Registered: Dec-03
Another section on that page;-

Beware; many program adverts confuse audio recorded for playback in a standard DVD player with true DVD Audio. Any DVD player can play back audio files that have been formatted for use in the VIDEO_TS directory and many freeware and shareware programmes are available that perform this task. They generally advertise themselves as allowing you to store CD's on DVD and offer huge recording time. The audio they record conforms to the standards in use for DVD video files and are generally compressed in AC3, MPEG or DTS formats. These programs do have an application but they are not suitable for producing true high fidelity DVD Audio discs.
 

New member
Username: Nestorleone

Buenos AiresArgentina

Post Number: 9
Registered: Aug-09
Cool.-.. it's true. I've gone crazy trying to find no-crap software.

It seems the choice I've made (read previous posts) It's ok. As the LPLEX project specifies that it writes true PCM data to de DVD-V. And then the DVD Audio Extractor recognizes the data writen on those DVD as PCM 24B96K..

Thank you guys!!! Hope this post helps people and the same quest I was on....
 

New member
Username: Whiterow

Post Number: 1
Registered: Dec-17
I have used my panasonic dmr-e60s' (1999 vintage), to burn onto maxell gold dvd-r blanks my even older prized cassette recordings of 1980's fm brocast music. using maxell C120 on a Uher timer-controlled nakamichi 700 ZXE and nakamichi 430 tuner.
tuner set often to hi-blend, to reduce sereo noise. cassette biasset at normal with 70 usecond de-emphasis, doby B. tape level,dolby tracking opomized using the decks A.B.L.E computer-tuning system. the final result is a disc which has characteristics of the better CD commercial discs.- ie noaudible hiss, excellent high-frequency content. I feel vindicated on my big spend, back in the day. - I had to tell somebody - the reasons for choosing this method, I had to be out when the programming I wanted was broadcast. could'nt contemplate dozens of 7" reels of R2R tape to store each year.my replay deck, A Nakmichi 550, has the same non-standard Nakamichi replay response.
the very-thin C120s'replay perfectly, cost a low 1 pound sterling each, in london. I sold the 700ZXE, near to what I paid for it, in 2012. the year- 550, functions as new, even the peak meter lamps.never used as a portable, never dropped. has focused-field permalloy head.

not clapped-out,cosmetically excellent, complete with Nak power supply 220-240V., carry strap, vinyl cover, nak lead. official UK Nak import, dealer suplied, owned by me from new.
if anyone else has similar idea, requirement:

will now sell Nak 550l. ring 0041(0)767135970 CET time.
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