B&W vs KEF
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New member Username: PaisleyparkPost Number: 4 Registered: Apr-06 | Hi, Please could someone comment on the following: B&W DM603, LCR600, DM600, ASW600 and the KEF iQ1, iQ2c, iQ5, PSW2500 Many thanks, P |
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Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 8303 Registered: May-04 | They all have a combination of numbers and letters. What is this, some kind of CIA cryptology exam? There isn't much to be said when the question is as wide open as you have left it. |
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Gold Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 1330 Registered: Sep-04 | paisley They each have their strengths and weaknesses. One thing though, I'm not a fan of either sub. Look at other brands from dedicated sub manufacturers such as Velodyne or REl for real performance. In fact B&W do make one good sub - PV-1, but that's well beyond your price range I think. Of the two choices you mention I'd probably take the B&Ws but only because I'm not fan of brighter sounding speakers (KEF). Then again, over here I'd get Dynaudios for very similar money (standmounts, not floorstanders) and they would knock spots off both your suggestions. Regards, Frank. |
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Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 8319 Registered: May-04 | Frank - Maybe he likes spots. |
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Gold Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 1334 Registered: Sep-04 | Hmm, perhaps... |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 2306 Registered: Dec-04 | Spot on? |
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Gold Member Username: GavincummNew York USA Post Number: 1012 Registered: Feb-05 | spot in? spot up? spot on top? spot on the side? |
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Gold Member Username: John_aLondonU.K. Post Number: 4142 Registered: Dec-03 | KEF. A short tale of value, service, customer satisfaction. Immaculate.... |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 2312 Registered: Dec-04 | Very good, John. Happy stories are timeless. |
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Bronze Member Username: Uback007Post Number: 70 Registered: Mar-06 | You guys are brutal...! I like both of the choices for HT...they both serve the experience very well - if it were me I would go with the B&W's - I think the 600 v3 series is tops for the money... Just my .02 :-) |
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Gold Member Username: John_aLondonU.K. Post Number: 4145 Registered: Dec-03 | Thanks, Nuck. I post that link from time to time. |
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Gold Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 1341 Registered: Sep-04 | Brutal? Why? It was just my opinion. |
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Bronze Member Username: Uback007Post Number: 75 Registered: Mar-06 | i was just commenting on the humor to the original question.. Sometimes people on this board can come across a little brash...that's all that I'm saying |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 2323 Registered: Dec-04 | I got the spot thing, Gavin. Little blue spots on top. |
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Gold Member Username: Project6Post Number: 7712 Registered: Dec-03 | Spot??? Spot remover? Spot the dog? Spot a good bargain? Spotted dick? Sorry Paisley...but anyway...have you listened to any of these? |
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Gold Member Username: GavincummNew York USA Post Number: 1018 Registered: Feb-05 | spotted dick? AARGH!!! DAMN YOU NUCK!!!! you didn't tell me you had HERPES!!!!! |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 2339 Registered: Dec-04 | And you didn't tell me you were married. |
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Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 8348 Registered: May-04 | And neither of you two told your wife your not straight! For shame!!! |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 2345 Registered: Dec-04 | Neither did Tom Cruise. |
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Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 8350 Registered: May-04 | Didn't have to. How dumb is Nicole? |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 2348 Registered: Dec-04 | But now he's a dad. Thanks to David Crosby(again) no doubt. Stout senior citizen ain't he? I think Melissa Etheridge and her wife lent him out(again). Who says it's only retired horses that go to stud? |
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Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 80 Registered: Aug-05 | Nice to se you guys are still jumping! To conclusions that is.  |
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Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 8358 Registered: May-04 | Hi, Margie; did you get the CD? |
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Gold Member Username: GavincummNew York USA Post Number: 1037 Registered: Feb-05 | wow... welcome back margie! |
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Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 81 Registered: Aug-05 | Hi Guys Thank you, nice to be back. My computer is up and running again but my cd burner is not. So...Jan I will be sending a disk but I guess it will just have to be a suprise one day in the mail. Yes I did receive your disk, thank you very much! It is a good test disk similar to what I do, meaning a wide variety of sound. But I just like it. It reminds me of the old reel to reel tapes. The selections were personal choices put together as you enjoyed listening to them....but I wax nostalgic. Thanks again! |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 2387 Registered: Dec-04 | Hi again, Margie. |
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New member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 6 Registered: May-06 | Having recently auditioned both Kef and B+W among many others, and ignoring all the good fun and ribbing above for the moment as I am new to the board, we voted for the Kef's. I would not describe them as "bright" at all. We auditioned B+W 603's and 703's, driven by a Denon, Rotel and Musical Fidelity amp. The 703's were well-balanced and open, the 603's not so much, especially when driven by anything less than the Musical Fidelity. Much to my surprise and disappointment, I might add... We went with Kef iQ3's for the front room and iQ9's in our main room. Both stereo only setups, driven by a NAD C720BEE. Nice Kef story, John. We're hoping to run these a very long time. |
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Gold Member Username: John_aLondonU.K. Post Number: 4210 Registered: Dec-03 | Hi from me, too, Margie! A pleasure, Aragorn. (BTW Good luck with mending the sword..... ) |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 13 Registered: May-06 | Thanks John. We all get by with a little help from our friends... |
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Silver Member Username: ShahrukhdMumbai, Maharashtra India Post Number: 138 Registered: Nov-04 | Hey Aragorn, how do the KEFs sound with NAD? Do you get enough detail. I'm running my iQ5s with a Marantz SR4400 and feel a lot of detail missing in stereo reproduction. |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 15 Registered: May-06 | We are VERY pleased. Unbelievable detail and clarity, nicely open and airy across the entire frequency range. Our iQ9's are rated to 8 ohms nominal, but the average load is closer to 5.5, and dips below 4 in the mid-bass region. They can be a bit of a challenge to drive. Our little NAD has a 300W power supply for a receiver rated to 50wpc, and "PowerDrive", basically a patented circuit that adjusts the power supply dynamics to the speakers changing load profile on-the-fly. It works. Give it a listen. |
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Silver Member Username: ShahrukhdMumbai, Maharashtra India Post Number: 139 Registered: Nov-04 | I'm guessing you're talking about the C320 BEE. They're the one rated at 50 wpc. Have you heard the iQ5s? What did you think of them? |
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Gold Member Username: Stu_pittIrvington, New York USA Post Number: 1340 Registered: May-05 | Shahrukh - The 320BEE and 720BEE have the same power section. The 720BEE is basically a 320BEE with a tuner and a few other features thrown in. |
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Silver Member Username: ShahrukhdMumbai, Maharashtra India Post Number: 140 Registered: Nov-04 | Yeah, I checked the NAD site. Figured out the 720 BEE was a receiver tho I must confess I hadn't heard of it. |
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Bronze Member Username: CrazyhorsePost Number: 32 Registered: Jun-05 | any thoughts on the B&W CM2's |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 16 Registered: May-06 | Yes, the C720BEE is a C320BEE with a RDS tuner instead of the phono inputs. They've just released the C325BEE with further refinements if you don't need/want the tuner. We still listen over the air quite a bit actually, so we went that route. I haven't heard the CM2's or the iQ5's. We did demo the B+W 603's and 703's, as well as the iQ7's. If the iQ5's sound anything near the iQ7's, they must be very nice indeed. We also liked the 703's. The 603's couldn't compete at this level, at least not to our ears. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 2862 Registered: Dec-04 | What did the 703's do for you Aragorn, and how were they priced? |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 18 Registered: May-06 | The first thing I noticed was that the differences between the 3 amps we had handy (Denon, Rotel, and Musical Fidelity) grew smaller - which I interpreted to mean that the 703's were easier to drive. The 603's sounded 'coarse' to me, even with the Rotel. Only the MF had the kahuna's to drive them. We're generally looking for a balanced, open sound, with good defination and a clearly defined soundstage. I'm not big on huge bass or forward trebles. The 703's delivered, but at 1.5x what our iQ9's cost. Hence the iQ9's in our family room now. We auditioned them at ListenUp in Boulder, CO. |
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Silver Member Username: Uback007Post Number: 110 Registered: Mar-06 | I really like the Monitor Audio Silver Series RS6's List $999 Have a listen :-) |
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New member Username: CvzPost Number: 1 Registered: Jun-06 | Aragorn, could you please give some more comments on the sound of the Kef iQ9's vs B&W 703's? I auditioned the two some time ago and liked the Kef's. Two dealers have subsequently made the comment that it would be a tough decision to decide between the two (despite the fact that the B&W's cost twice as much as the Kefs in South Africa). This suggests that the Kefs can compete with significantly more expensive speakers. (It is worth noting that the B&W 705's won the 2004 EISA award and the Kef iQ3's won the 2005 EISA award for best loudspeaker). |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 22 Registered: May-06 | Colin, Sorry for the delay in responding, we've been away on vacation/holiday. I thought that the 703's and the iQ9's were very close, almost indistinguishable to my ear. Both are big, well-rounded floorstanders offering full-range audiophile sound, without any significant deficiencies, again, to my ear. I listened to both on the same day, within the hour, but I wasn't able to AB them directly, because no dealer in our area carries both lines. The Kef's offer more dispersion due to their design. The soundstage is significantly wider. Clarity is simply awesome, and they're very balanced. Some reviewers have reported a "warm mid-bass" on the iQ9's. I don't hear it. On the contrary, I've been impressed with the tight, controlled bass of these speakers. Nothing mushy or overdone to my ear. I can only suggest that you listen to both carefully, and judge for yourself. For the money, the Kef's are very hard to beat. We have the "dark apple" color. They're easy on the eyes, too. Simply gorgeous. They did need some break-in. It took several days for them to open up. What can I say ? We like them. They do want a receiver/amp with some kahuna's, as I've suggested above. We also auditioned the iQ7's - very similar sound, the 9's have more bottom end. We went with the 9's rather than investing in a separate sub. hth |
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New member Username: CvzPost Number: 2 Registered: Jun-06 | Thanks, Aragorn. I did give the two a listen this weekend and was surprised that speakers with vastly different prices could sound so close in terms of sound quality. Its an easy decision to go for the iQ9's. Maybe B&W will be revising the 700 series in the next year or two? |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3082 Registered: Dec-04 | The Kef's FR seems a bit high, with low end at 38Hz. The mass of the speaker is a bit light as well. Not to berate the items before listening(which I will), but compared to the 703's at 62 lbs(sans plinth) and a lower bass, I wonder. Of course, at the same time, the Proac 140's are 44 lbs(with plinth) and rated 25 Hz. Lots of flavours! |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 23 Registered: May-06 | Nuck, It's my understanding that the lowest key on a grand piano is 28Hz. The lowest note on a bass electric guitar or stand-up bass is 40Hz. Practically speaking, I don't see how we're missing much when they begin to roll off under 40Hz. HT is a different matter, of course. As to buying "by the pound", well, that's an interesting approach we hadn't considered... We also auditioned several other speakers priced well above the Kef's - Vienna's for instance. In every case, they held their own when driven by a proper amp. YMMV, of course. |
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Bronze Member Username: Daniel_canadaCanada Post Number: 85 Registered: May-06 | Base guitar only down to 40, thought it would be lower. Question, How low can Yo-Yo go on his cello? (Yo-Yo Ma) |
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Gold Member Username: John_aLondonU.K. Post Number: 4294 Registered: Dec-03 | 65.406 Hz http://www.phys.unsw.edu.au/~jw/notes.html http://www.psbspeakers.com/audioTopics.php?fpId=8&page_num=2&start=8 |
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Bronze Member Username: Daniel_canadaCanada Post Number: 87 Registered: May-06 | 65.406 Hz for Yo-Yo? The piano tops at 4.1k? Damn, thought that would be higher. And lower for Yo-Yo. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3089 Registered: Dec-04 | Well, Aragorn, I'm not selling England by the pound, purchasing by solidity seems a reasonable monitor. Cabinet resonance is a bit of a sticky wicket for me, and I have heard a lot of lightish speakers that I could not stand for resonance, let alone coloration. Heft does not automatically begat neutrality, but does tend to leave the box to colour(or not) without resonance.IMHO. 33.5Hz on the spectrometer for VH 'unchained"(not mine, of course) |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 24 Registered: May-06 | Nuck, I see where you're headed with the weight - as one indicator among many of susceptability to coloration. Kind of like (initially) gauging an amp by its weight. The Kef's curved tear-drop cabinet shape is much stiffer than a rectangular box front to rear, and internally reinforced to suppress vibrations traveling vertically. The shape is computer designed to eliminate standing waves inside the enclosure. Like all good speaker companies, they do extensive modeling and computer aided design, using finite element analysis and an anechoic chamber. |
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Gold Member Username: John_aLondonU.K. Post Number: 4295 Registered: Dec-03 | Dan, Those frequencies are the fundamental frequencies for each note. So Yo-Yo's cello make no sound below 64.406 Hz. And the top note on a piano makes no sound below 4.1 kHz. But, there are harmonics based on the fundamental. They are added to the fundamental, or mixed in, in different proportions, giving the instrument its characteristic timbre. So 4.1 kHz will give you the fundamental of the highest note on a piano, but you won't be able to tell it is a piano making it. For that, you need to reproduce even higher frequencies. Same for the cello - the open, bottom string sounds different from bass guitar playing C2 (third fret on A string) partly because of the harmonics. The upshot for speakers is that a small bookshelf-type speaker is usually better for music than a massive thing which vibrates your internal organs but cannot render the higher frequencies of upper harmonics accurately. |
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Bronze Member Username: Daniel_canadaCanada Post Number: 89 Registered: May-06 | John A. I assume the room the system is in can make a difference too, as well as spearker placement will have an effect. Yo-Yo's cello can make some powerfull music, low and strong. I swear I can hear the texture of the strings on the cello and the bow. It's that nice. I have no knowledge of music or how it's made or played, so things like "guitar playing C2 (third fret on A string)" puts me out in left field. I just like what I hear. |
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Gold Member Username: John_aLondonU.K. Post Number: 4296 Registered: Dec-03 | ...who would be happy with a speaker producing 64.406 Hz OK, but unable to tell the difference between Yo-Yo Ma and Suzi Quatro...? |
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Bronze Member Username: Daniel_canadaCanada Post Number: 90 Registered: May-06 | Yeah, numbers mean nothing if it does not sound right. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3094 Registered: Dec-04 | Quattro. |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 25 Registered: May-06 | Indeed. This is ultimately what I was driving at - that the Kef's sound great at an affordable price point, and the spec's should not be over-analyzed. When Peter Cincotti starts jamming on his piano, and you can hear every string ring as he strikes a key, as well as other strings ringing in harmony - wow! It's just beautiful. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3095 Registered: Dec-04 | Remember 'Happy Days'? The double episode with Fonz in the demo derby against the Pisani brothers? And Fonz fell for the chick leading the band? Thats Suzi Quattro. Gawd am I ever old. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3096 Registered: Dec-04 | I have to demo the Kef's. Like Aragorn says, points on paper ain't where it's at. |
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Gold Member Username: John_aLondonU.K. Post Number: 4297 Registered: Dec-03 | Thanks for "Quattro", Nuck! Dan;- Well, "C2" is just the name for the note C, two whole octaves below the middle C on a piano. C2 is the lowest note on a cello. The lowest note on the bass guitar is an E - "E1" according to that link. The lowest note on any stringed instrument is the note from the lowest, thickest "open" string - "open" meaning the string is allowed to vibrate through its whole length, and is not being pressed down, with the left hand, onto the finger board (cello) or fretboard (guitar). That action has the effect of decreasing the length of the string, so increasing the frequency of its vibration - which is to say raising the pitch of the note that the string produces. Both the cello and the bass guitar have four open strings. All the notes they play are obtained by pressing on, or "stopping", one of those. "Double stopping" is when a string player plays, and stops, two strings at the same time. |
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New member Username: CvzPost Number: 3 Registered: Jun-06 | Nuck, Hi-Fi Choice (Nov 2005) rated the Kef iQ9's at 25Hz (-6dB) and the Kef specs mention 38Hz (-3dB). This can be compared to the B&W rating for the B&W 703's of 30Hz (-6dB) and 38Hz (-3dB). Hi-Fi Choice also mentions that the iQ9 "cabinet coloration as such is clearly very low, and the dynamic range wide, as the enclosure itself is very rigid and well controlled" and "despite the much larger enclosure, there's no real evidence of significant cabinet coloration here, so clearly the substantial bracing is working well." |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3100 Registered: Dec-04 | Those comments seem a lot more in line with what you describe hearing, Colin. Thanks. |
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Gold Member Username: John_aLondonU.K. Post Number: 4300 Registered: Dec-03 | For what it's worth, personally, I'd go with KEF. It is partly brand identity and previous experience as much as anything. You want the best speaker, of course. You might also consider that KEF's founder, Raymond Cooke, was an original, and one of the audio greats, published many papers on speaker design, and was sometime president of the AES. Uni-Q is a clever idea to make the tweeter and bass-midrange drivers coincident, so the sound comes from the same place at the same time, avoiding phase differences around the crossover. There is also the fact that KEF made, and make, drivers for many other makers who rely on KEF for what they put in their different boxes. The famous BBC LS3/5a you will read about was built around KEF drivers. Anyway, KEF is certainaly no less of a maker than B&W. If KEF has a lower visibility, it is probably just that they spend less on marketing. That could just mean better value. Who knows. |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 26 Registered: May-06 | So the Kef's have more extension into the lower bass regions than the 703's, according to the spec's. Interesting. Kef is said to do very well overseas, but is not that well know in the States, outside of New England. Not sure why. |
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New member Username: CvzPost Number: 4 Registered: Jun-06 | I auditioned the iQ9's and 703's on a Rotel RB-1080 amplifier (200 watts per channel). The dealer agreed that the Kef iQ9's sounded better but added that the 703's require stronger amplification (either Rotel's 380 watt per channel amp or their new 500 watt per channel digital amp). I did not audution the 703's with a stronger amp and cannot comment on this. However, it does not make sense to me that B&W would design a mid-range speaker that requires so much amplification to really sound good. I am not willing to spend that much on amplification and the iQ9's therefore seem to be the best option. |
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Silver Member Username: Uback007Post Number: 112 Registered: Mar-06 | What about comparing the iQ9's to the Monitor Audio Silver RS6's? That would be a good match for comparison. Anyone? Bueller? |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3108 Registered: Dec-04 | It has been noted here a few times that the B&W really beg for Better power, not just More power. I don't see how a 380w Rotel will be any better than a 200w Rotel with 250w speakers. Bryston, Sim and a couple of others were suggested, and I must think that Radio Shack speakers would sound so much better with a Moon W7 integrated. Thanks, Colin. Spend twice on amp as spending on speakers? |
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New member Username: CvzPost Number: 5 Registered: Jun-06 | Nuck, The RB-1080 has received excellent reviews from all publications. Their new 500 watt digital amp also appears to be receiving good reviews. In addition, B&W speakers seem to be paired with Rotel often in the UK (even in photos of B&W's own marketing literature). Do you think Rotel is not up to B&W's requirements? I cannot claim to be an expert - I am really just repeating what I have read and some of my own experiences. Considering your comment about spending, do you think iQ9's with a RB-1080 strikes the right balance? Thanks |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3111 Registered: Dec-04 | I demo'd the 703's with the 1080, but didn't let em rip(too new), and liked the effect. Dealer there and Folks here said the same thing. "You should hear them with a 'insert a better amp here'" However, for the time being, the Kef's are my next listen, pref with Rotel 1080 again. My present power is RB985 and I intend to bi-amp. The bass extension may be reason enough to ditch my cheap subs and receiver powering them. So is that a good balance? I dunno. Just like always, listen and judge. I am also seeking Revel Concerto to aud, on another rec or 2. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3112 Registered: Dec-04 | http://www.htguide.com/forum/archive/index.php4/t-12891 |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 28 Registered: May-06 | I noticed that as you went up the B+W line, "better" power became less of a factor, as noted above. In other words, there was less difference between amps when driving the 703's than there was when driving the 603's, for instance. At the sound levels we were listening at, the peak output power was hardly a factor, even after accounting for logarithmic relations and all that. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3130 Registered: Dec-04 | I checked for Kef dealers back in Ontario here, there are none at the moment, it seems. Apparantly the importer (Lenbrook, again) has made more enemies yet. The line has been turned over 3 or 4 times, at least up here, and has inspired little confidence. Not sure of other places. |
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Silver Member Username: Daniel_canadaCanada Post Number: 115 Registered: May-06 | You can get Kef here Nuck. There must be one or two imported in all of Canada that imports 90% of this stuff. Who imports Grado earphones here? BTW, have you seen the new Grado GS1000 phones? They sell for 1k USD online. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3140 Registered: Dec-04 | I saw them in passing, Dan, not a phones guy meself. Yet. May be a blessing when the drum kit is back in place, though. |
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Silver Member Username: Daniel_canadaCanada Post Number: 124 Registered: May-06 | There must be one or two imported in all of Canada that imports 90% of this stuff........should read: There must be one or two importers in all of Canada that imports 90% of this stuff PROOFREAD! I have the Grado 125s, nice unit. Try'em out, |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3144 Registered: Dec-04 | I PROOFREAD! Got the point, as we all usually do, unless it's really funny goof! Yeah, I think Grado has the whole thing right. I see Bose sets in airports with noise cancellation and all, does Grado even bother with that? Not on home kits for sure. I don't even carry a portable music player... |
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Silver Member Username: Daniel_canadaCanada Post Number: 126 Registered: May-06 | Grados are an "open" design. That means you can hear you Wife from across the room while trying to listen to music, and the person next to you can hear the music. Grado said they are coming out with a new line of cans that there are calling "street style". I guess all the cool kids don't want to look like a 1930's telephone operator. Personaly I don't care what someone else thinks of my cans, I know they are the r0x0r. |
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Gold Member Username: Project6Post Number: 8302 Registered: Dec-03 | Hello May Lau, You are a spammer, get out of here. Pay to advertise instead of rudley hijacking a thread and spamming it with your crap. |
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New member Username: CvzPost Number: 6 Registered: Jun-06 | Returning to the original questions and comments made about the subwoofers: Would the B&W PV1 be a good match for the Kef iQ9's? I am also considering the B&W ASW 750 but it is quite expensive and probably overkill for the iQ9's and the rest of the system. Thanks |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 33 Registered: May-06 | Too bad about the lack of distribution in your area, Nuck. I hate to see a great product suffer from crappy marketing. Good luck. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3151 Registered: Dec-04 | Colin, I thought you went for the 9's over the 7's to negate the sub usage. Is this the case? |
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New member Username: CvzPost Number: 7 Registered: Jun-06 | Nuck, I think Aragorn chose the iQ9's (stereo setup) for that reason. I am rather looking at a surround setup based on iQ9's, iQ3's and an iQ6c with a sub that I intend to use for home theatre as well as stereo. The PV1 seems to be a good subwoofer option for this with the B&W ASW 700 a possible alternative. Any thoughts? |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3170 Registered: Dec-04 | Sorry about that, Colin. If you do go forward with the setup, might you want to try the 5 piece before choosing a sub? Your HT choice might seem a lot different once the pieces are placed to your liking. I figgur the sub is an easy add-on, after your pieces are happily playing along. |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3171 Registered: Dec-04 | Colin, where do you live? Country-wise. |
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New member Username: CvzPost Number: 8 Registered: Jun-06 | Nuck, I live in South Africa. We have most of the products that are available in the UK but pricing is often very different. (Aragorn mentioned that the B&W 703's were 1,5 times the price of the Kef iQ9's - here the B&W's are exactly double the price). Brands that are well supported seem to be Rotel, Boston Acoustics, Kef, Jamo, Polk Audio, Denon, Yamaha and Marantz (I am sure there are more). |
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Gold Member Username: NuckPost Number: 3175 Registered: Dec-04 | Happy winter down there from summer up here! Hmm...not many really good ones to choose from, as you said, B&W are not sub-known, except when you spend big. Where's Frank A when you need him? |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 38 Registered: May-06 | Colin, Nuck, you are correct that we went with the 9's instead of the 7's to alleviate the need for a sub in our "mostly music" room. For a separate HT set up downstairs, I'm researching subs in other threads. |
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Gold Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 1465 Registered: Sep-04 | Hello Nuck, been on holiday away from "da internet". Colin, I dislike the ASW range of subs by B&W intensely. They sound like coloured cardboard boxes to me. No doubt that they produce a lot of bass, but I rather like my bass to have definition and shape. On the other hand the PV-1 is a jewel. Why oh why can't B&W make all their subs perform like this? It's an excellent sub with very little character of its own and good extension. Other subs I rate: Velodyne's SPL and DD ranges are excellent. The SPL800R and SPL1000R give very well defined bass with bags of control as you'd expect from a 1000W amp and almost no character whatsoever. Very impressive. The DD range (probably beyond what you wanted to spend) has more control and a far superior room EQ program that really gives you some control on what goes on in your room. (The SPL range has a relatively simple EQ program.) The DD range then comes in with a 1250W amps and minimum 10 inch drive unit. They're very good indeed and go lower than most subs from smaller enclosures thanks to their unique driver technology with very large excursion capability. M&K (Miller & Kreisel): These guys make very good subs indeed. They are just going through a range revamp with all-new drivers (called the Superfast)and I am awaiting delivery of my own M&K MX-7000SF with which I have had some excellent results. I reckon the MX-7000SF is the best value for money in their range. It's small and unobtrusive but packs a hell of a wallop with great definition and almost no character, a lot better than the outgoing 700 which was already a fine sub. The M&Ks don't have the clever room EQ programming of the Velodynes. They just do what they do very well. The 7000 is priced at about the same as the SPL1000R here in the UK. REL: I have no experience of the brand new range from REL. Traditionally, REL have been one of the big boys in the subwoofer arena. They recently released a brand new range which should be very good too. Regards, Frank. |
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Bronze Member Username: BvgArvada, CO Post Number: 39 Registered: May-06 | Frank, At the risk of hijacking this thread..., do you have an opinion on the Mirage Omni S10? |
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Gold Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 1476 Registered: Sep-04 | Nope sorry, never heard Mirages... Regards, Frank. |
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New member Username: CvzPost Number: 9 Registered: Jun-06 | Frank, Thanks for the comments. I decided to go with the B&W PV1 and I am thrilled with it. Regards Colin |
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Gold Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 1484 Registered: Sep-04 | Colin, Glad to hear it. It's a great sub. Regards, Frank. |
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