My thoughts on the NAD C162/272 combo
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New member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 4 Registered: Nov-05 | For hi-res surround music and 5.1 surround movies my Marantz SR-7300 serves me very well - really excellent in fact. For stereo music it is very good, but after listening to DVD-A or SACD in surround, it often seems a little lacking in certain areas. So, is the addition of a NAD C162/C272 pre & power amp worth the expense to enjoy my CD collection? How does it compare to the wonderful Marantz SR-7300? The first difference I noticed was the slam. This combo has power to burn - giving the volume a gentle nudge the first time is like getting in your car, touching the gas pedal and discovering someone stuck a racing engine under the hood when you weren't looking. The second was the precise imaging - I thought the Marantz did this well but it's a big improvement as is the deeper soundstage and space around the instruments. The music is full bodied and very smooth, the mids very well defined, the high end exceptionally clean and the decay on the metal stuff adds a great sense of realism and any harsh edginess which some would call bright is nowhere to be heard. The bass in particular seems more rounded, fatter even, though slightly tighter than the Marantz's low end. Even vocals, both male and female, benefit from slight increase in clarity and richness. I've now played music with this combo for many, many hours without tiring from its wonderful sound. Additional benefits are the various power on methods. (1) The 12v trigger allowing the remote to switch both units from standby to on or vice versa. (2) The sleep/wake switch on the power amp allows it to power up from standby when it senses a signal and back after a few minutes with an absence of signal, though I found this handy being somewhat immobile after a run-in with a surgeon, it takes a bit of volume for it to sense the signal and can go back to standby too quickly if your listening is interupted or if the volume setting is too low. (3) Turn on the power amp the old fashioned way from stanby to power on or back to standby with the power button. More goodies are the two sets of outputs on the pre-amp - one being variable - and the twin input sets on the power amp - again with one being variable. This was a convenient touch when I connected my main L&R channels to the power amp from the pre-outs on the Marantz AVR and made the adjustments to synchronise the sound levels. The extra slam adds more weight to the surround music and movies without really altering the timbre - just another improvement. Another goody is the acclaimed phono section allowing either MM or MC cartridges. A turntable on the horizon - one never knows does one? Now hi-res surround compared to stereo? Well, the surround sound from good DVD-A's and SACD's really does something for me so much so that I had rated stereo a distant second place. Now stereo has found new legs with the NAD jockeying for position. A photo finnish maybe? We'll have to wait and see for that one. The build quality of this NAD combo is up there with that of the Marantz which I always thought was excellent. I've listened to old and newer recordings, rock, blues and jazz, soft and loud (about 10 o'clock on the dial was the limit for my ears) and so far I cannot fault this gear, in a review I read somewhere the guy stated that this combo can release one from one's pre-occupation with audio gear. I can believe that, however I shall try to refrain from listening to anything considered better for quite some time - if ever. BTW - the interconnects from the pre to the power amp are cheap "Tandy" or Radioshack equivalents I had on hand. So things should only improve further when I get a chance to get out and about and obtain something better. My rating is 5 out of 5. The money, though quite a lot was well spent. The NAD C162 and C272 are great value in my opinion. For components used - see my details. |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 2290 Registered: Feb-05 | Excellent reading MR. I really like having the 2 sets of pre outs as I use one for my music sub and the other for my Hafler amp. Better interconnects will definitely yield better results. I'm glad you're enjoying your new gear. |
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Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 6673 Registered: May-04 | "The first difference I noticed was the slam. This combo has power to burn ... " Ah, for the want of a two and one half watt single ended triode tube! |
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New member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 6 Registered: Nov-05 | "Ah, for the want of a two and one half watt single ended triode tube!" Yeah, but just because they glow doesn't mean they have soul? |
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Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 6674 Registered: May-04 | OK, are you going to take a crack at defining a soul? https://www.ecoustics.com/electronics/forum/home-audio/176317.html |
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New member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 7 Registered: Nov-05 | I saw that discussion between you and EC. But do you really think the Macs will get past St Peter when their time comes? Kidding aside, I thought it wasn't a bad analogy to describe a system that is possessed with a quality sound spirit. |
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New member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 8 Registered: Nov-05 | Er - that's ER. It's these darn religious analogies. |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 2292 Registered: Feb-05 | I do remember telling a certain gentleman from "down under" that well recorded cd's played on seperates through a dedicated cd player sound as good if not better (occasionally) than the hi res discs. :-) I'm glad you're enjoying your new gear and God speed on your recovery. That C162 is one heck of great buy. Caution: IF YOU GET A TURNTABLE THERE WILL BE NO TURNING BACK !!!! WARNING !!! WARNING!!!! |
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New member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 9 Registered: Nov-05 | Art Thanks for your kind thoughts. Yes, I am believing what you said - up to a point. In fact the C272 has improved the hi-res as well as it is now powering the front L&R speakers. The trouble with a turntable is getting the vinyl (in decent condition) and adding another component in the near future might be stretching my relationship. But I'm sure "the voice" will be back and start nagging me at some stage. |
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Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 6676 Registered: May-04 | "But do you really think the Macs will get past St Peter when their time comes?" Christ! We all know God wants a full Mac system. And, the Holy Spirit is pushing hard for tubes. |
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Silver Member Username: NuckParkhill, Ontario Canada Post Number: 500 Registered: Dec-04 | But the son wants to rock and roll! |
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New member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 10 Registered: Nov-05 | I found I had another pair of cheap Monster (standard) interconnects and used those instead of the cheaper "Radioshack" types. No difference but I really expected that. Any recommendations for 'not breaking the bank' interconnects for the NAD combo. What about Audioquest Sidewinder or Chord Calypso or would I still need to spend more to do justice to this gear? http://www.wickeddigital.com.au/home.php?cat=314 "Christ! We all know God wants a full Mac system. And, the Holy Spirit is pushing hard for tubes." Blasphemer! |
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Silver Member Username: Sun_kingLeeds, West Yorkshire UK Post Number: 301 Registered: Mar-04 | I use QED Qunex silver spiral between pre & power, I found that they really let the highs & lows come through. Other interconnects I've tried lose some of the sound. They work great between pre & power but when I used them from the cdp to the pre they weren't half as nice. I use Cambridge Audio Studio reference interconnects into the pre amp but the Qunex are by far the best I've tried inbetween the amps. |
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Bronze Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 11 Registered: Nov-05 | S.K. Thanks but I think QED Qunex silver spiral would cost an arm and leg over here, but I'll look into it. |
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Silver Member Username: DanmanQUEBEC CANADA Post Number: 592 Registered: Apr-04 | Not to rain on anyones parade here but recently I was lucky enough to loan some 2000$ cables (whose name I will have to remember when I get home!) and compared to my Cambridge models I own. I found NO difference at all even when I tried hard! I thought that maybe my ears are getting old but even if there was a difference it was certainly not worth the extra 1900$! Speaker cables however, have done it for me but even then, I wonder if it is not only psychological!? |
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Bronze Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 14 Registered: Nov-05 | Thanks Dan - Guess I'll have to be sure I can get a refund if I try better cables. |
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Silver Member Username: SimplymcintoshPost Number: 292 Registered: Jan-05 | Christ! We all know God wants a full Mac system. Amen, Brother Jan! Nice write-up, Rantz! Glad to hear you are enjoying the NAD combo. |
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Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 6866 Registered: May-04 | Say Hey, SM! |
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Bronze Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 53 Registered: Nov-05 | SM, Thanks. Yeah, the NAD is really fine gear. Good to see you're still alive and kicking. Hope all is well. |
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Silver Member Username: SimplymcintoshPost Number: 294 Registered: Jan-05 | MR, What led you to give the NAD combo a try? |
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Bronze Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 57 Registered: Nov-05 | SM It was the voice in my head! Wife and I went into the local NAD dealer on one of my whims just to hear some of their 2 channel gear. On demo was the C352 and C372 with only C540 CD player. Needless to say we were both impressed with both amps even though using a C5401 or a C542 CD would have been better. There was no pre and power amp on hand to demo but the dealer said there was even more sound improvement with the combo (which I had read about quite often). Even though Mrs Rantz suggested we could purchase the C372 if I wanted it, I suggested we needed the money for more important things and we left empty handed. After comparing what I had heard on our receiver, the voice in my head began its quest to convince me about getting some good 2 channel gear. A week later I was talking to my usual audio dealer and I told him of my audition in his competition's shop. He immediately picked up the phone and came back with a tempting deal on the NAD combo - he was tied to another NAD dealership in another city. I thought If I did this it would be my 2 channel kit for keeps. So I relented haven't looked back since. |
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Silver Member Username: NuckParkhill, Ontario Canada Post Number: 699 Registered: Dec-04 | Gotta love good ol' Mrs. Rantz for that offer. Quite a bit of restraint on your part MR. Very good deal for a lot of patience. |
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Bronze Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 59 Registered: Nov-05 | I do Nuck, I'm a very lucky fella. Obviously, the restraint didn't last to long, however the patience did pay off.  |
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Silver Member Username: SimplymcintoshPost Number: 296 Registered: Jan-05 | That's awesome! I'm glad it worked out for you and you are pleased with the combo. Congrats! |
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Bronze Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 97 Registered: Nov-05 | Well, we had a little windfall and the wonderful Mrs Rantz suggested adding a C542 to the combo. We auditioned, bought, and spent half the day listening to various cd's. Very impressed - not a giant difference from the CC4300 but certainly enough to make music even more special. HDCD's, of which I have quite a few, sound truly fabulous. The C542 has wonderful clarity in the mid/highs, great detail, and solid, but not overblown bass. And is quite dynamic overall. It was a worthwhile step up imho. The recent acquisitions will be considered my xmas and b/day gifts for the next decade :-) So for both stereo, hi-res surround, and movies, I've now really got it made. It may not be 'the be all and end all' of gear, but it'll sure do for me. Guess I'm just a lucky so and so! |
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Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 754 Registered: May-05 | MR, Fantastic first review and thoughts. So, how has the sound evolved since the system broke in and the CDP was added? Your original description said much better than I could some of the distinctions/differences I'm hearing with the Adcom addition. I haven't seen a tremendous difference in the output volume, although there's proably 3-4 db there. It's the incredibly clear sound that exists throughout the volume range without any degradation that I notice and the immediacy and of the bass and the clear highs and transparent midrange that sounds so much better. Yes, there's more soul and like pornogr@phy, you don't have to define it, because you "know it when you see [hear]it, at least according to our Supreme Court. As for connections, I, too, am using fairly mundane Radio Shack connections between the Denon and the Adcom and they're fine for HT duty, I believe. Tell Mrs. MR that she is an incredible lady and you're a lucky guy. Merry Christmas and enjoy. Dave |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 2485 Registered: Feb-05 | Congrats on your C542 MR. Ain't it wonderful! Merry Christmas and a Very Happy New Year. Bring it in with beautiful music. |
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Bronze Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 100 Registered: Nov-05 | Dave, Will tell more after more listening over the next week. Mrs Rantz surely is an incredible lady - regardless of allowing me my audio indulgences. Thanks to both you and Art A special Christmas and a happy, healthy New Year to both you guys, your families and all the other usual suspects and theirs: you all know who you are - well, I hope you do.  Cheers M.R. |
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Gold Member Username: Larry_rNaples, FL Post Number: 1090 Registered: Oct-04 | Ho, Ho, Ho! Just have to jump in here to wish y'all the Happiest of Holidays! Posted on Old Dogs, but want to add here some congrats to My Rantz on the new gear! Hope all your medical, uh, "impositions" resolve themselves quickly and painlessly. And Jan - isn't a "soul" what precedes a "heal" in the wunnerful world of religious zealotry? Think so. . . (double grin) Please don't get me involved in any convoluted arguments, though - I was only trying a light moment. . . Now that I have a new computer, and my broadband connection is again working, I'll try to eavesdrop on y'all from time to time. Merri and I send y'all our Very Best for the Season!!! Respectfully, LR |
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Sam Mosa Unregistered guest | Excellent and informative review, My Rantz. I have decided to upgrade my old faithful Sansui to the 162/272 combo as well. As much as I prefer stereo, I'm open to multi-channel listening as well. I hardly watch TV, news mostly, and spend my free time listening to music. The 162's phono input is a plus as I have an old Technics 'table that I use regularly. I have a couple of questions, though... When the time (and budget) comes for me to jump the multi-channel wagon, what are my options? Please help me out here. A) Can I get the NAD T163 pre-amp or T973 7-ch amp? B) Which one of those can I hook up to the 162/272 combo? C) Or should I just get a simpler A/V receiver? Can I still connect it to the 162/272? The reason I want to get into multi-channel is to experience the DVD-audio and/or SACD format. Of course, the upgrade to multi-ch isn't happening soon after the 162/272. It will have to wait a while after I pay for the latter. A school teacher's pay doesn't allow for many luxuries. Would appreciate any helpful input. thanks, Sam |
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Silver Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 110 Registered: Nov-05 | Sam, It really depends on your budget and also, I don't know what the prices are in your country. But, to serve all music forms (including vinyl) I suggest you try the 162/272 combo and a NAD (or other) A/V receiver later. |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 2560 Registered: Feb-05 | Sam, I have an inexpensive but pretty good AVR that I add to my C162 and power amp for multichannel duties. This is how I do it: I use the AVR as yet another source component hooked up to the video or aux on your pre and to power the center and rears. Leave the AVR off completely when listening to 2 channel. I go from the L/R front pre outs on the AVR to the video in on my NAD C162 pre. The C162 pre has 2 sets of pre outs. I use 1 set to go to the power amp and the other to go to the sub that I use for 2 channel. I have another sub connected to the LFE of the AVR for HT. I have to set the pre amp volume control to a set mark when I calibrate the home theater and return it to that setting every time I listen to it. It's key to remember to turn it back down before returning to 2 channel use or you can blow your fronts. It's a bit of pain but well worth it to me for better 2 channel and multichannel performance. This has changed a bit since I wrote that as I now have an Outlaw M-Block for the center channel. |
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Silver Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 113 Registered: Nov-05 | The only problem (if it is one) with Art's suggestion is that for hi-res music the amp won't provide the extended frequency response (20hz-20khz compared to around 5 or 10hz - 100khz for analogue inputs). This would only be beneficial if the speakers have the extended frequency ranges also. However, I'm not sure we really hear an audible difference (perhaps not at my age). |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 2563 Registered: Feb-05 | Why wouldn't it MR? |
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Sam Mosa Unregistered guest | Thanks, MR / Art I cited the T163/973 as A/V upgrade options as I was browsing the NAD website. But I realized, and as Art suggested, I could opt for a less expensive AVR to hook into the C162. In any case, I have to get the C162/272 combo first and save and scrimp for the next upgrade. thanks for the input, Sam P.S. MR, I live in Norfolk, CA (U.S. of A). The prices aren't the problem. It's the money! |
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Silver Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 114 Registered: Nov-05 | Art, Well, I admit to being a little naive when it comes to audio knowledge, but most amps have a frequency response of 20hz to 20khz whereas receivers or surround amps today offer a much lower and higher range to accommodate the high resolution formats - at least that's what I have been lead to believe. If have things bass akwards then I am all ears - er - eyes :-) |
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Silver Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 115 Registered: Nov-05 | Sam, If you haven't heard NAD before, I advise auditioning before buying. That said, I doubt you'll be disappointed. Good Luck and let us know what you do and what you think when you have done the deed. "The prices aren't the problem. It's the money!" |
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Sam Mosa Unregistered guest | MR, I've heard the NAD and that prompted mean to start saving for it (and I mean saving). So now I have enough to buy a C162/272 combo. I better do it fast... before the orthodontist digs into my wallet for my son's braces! |
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Sam Mosa Unregistered guest | That should read Norwalk, CA. (Was listening to some folk music while typing. Must be my age.) |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 2566 Registered: Feb-05 | SACD was first a 2 channel format meant to be played on standard 2 channel gear. I believe that the extended frequency range in AVR's is intended for movies and their extremes. In any case I don't see any indication that the NAD won't reach any part of the audible range. I think........lol! |
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Silver Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 116 Registered: Nov-05 | Sam Yes, do it now! Wrong Art - speaker manufacturers are extending their products frequency ranges to accomodate SACD. See B&W for example. Gotta go shopping for now Cheers guys |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 2567 Registered: Feb-05 | I thought you were talking about receivers not speakers. |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 2568 Registered: Feb-05 | The C162's frequency response is 3hz to 70khz which should do the job don't you think. |
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Silver Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 117 Registered: Nov-05 | Back from shopping and I was good - only came home with a cheap remastered copy of Santana's Abraxas. "The C162's frequency response is 3hz to 70khz which should do the job don't you think." Yes, it certainly should Art - thanks - I missed that, good to see they have extended the range from the norm. The analogue inputs on the later A/V receivers have extended range - as I read on some Marantz material somewhere - for the benefit of the hi-res formats such as SACD, DVD-A etc and if the original intention was for movies so be it, you may well be right. I mentioned speakers merely as an example of manufacturers accommodating the hi-res extended frequencies. Obviously, the newer amps etc are doing likewise though some specs still quote 20hz-20khz. As I said, I am running my mains from the C272 - saves me from switching when listening to surround (Marantz AVR) and stereo (NAD combo) - and it works well. Have a good healthy, happy and prosperous year my friend. |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 2570 Registered: Feb-05 | "The analogue inputs on the later A/V receivers have extended range - as I read on some Marantz material somewhere - for the benefit of the hi-res formats such as SACD, DVD-A etc and if the original intention was for movies so be it, you may well be right." So does my Yamaha and they do state that it is for hi res material. Happy New Year to you MR! |
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Bronze Member Username: AsimoPost Number: 62 Registered: Apr-04 | It was a real surprise to find all the members of the ancient threads still alive and doing well. I had great pleasure to discover that NAD rules again after it looked that they lost to McIntosh. I read very carefully MR report about NAD pre power combo and I could not agree more. I still prefer my 90th NAD Monitor 7000 receiver over the NAD C352 or C372 integrated and I do have NAD C350 not in use. In my opinion NAD monitor series of the 90th was similar to the new NAD Master series. Unfortunately I do not have the pre/ power of the Monitor series and if I will change my audio it will be to NAD C162/C272 pre/power. In the video section I have some improvement. I added Mitsubishi HC100 front projector and the result is amazing. The picture is spread on the wall about 2.5 meters wide much better than any LCD or plasma screens. The Mitsubishi HC100 is a very modest projector cost about $1000 but the picture is clear and sharp. Now for the attention of Larry R SM and John A, some of the recommended DVD's that I added recently to my collection: Mozart Requiem Vienna Philharmonic Solti Decca 1991 Handel Messiah Academy and Chorus St Martin in the Fields Sir Neville Marriner - Philips 1992 European Concert 1994 Berliner Philharmonic Claudio Abbado Beethoven Piano Concerto No 5 Daniel Barenboim Brahms Sym No2 TDK 2002 I do not use any surround, only stereo but I found that the new digital DVI connection from the computer or DVD player to the projector transfers excellent video. I also have a Hi-Fi external sound card SB Extigy. Watching and listening to these DVD's give you a feeling of being there, in the concert hall. |
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Silver Member Username: My_rantzAustralia Post Number: 120 Registered: Nov-05 | Asimo Good to hear from you again. Yes, some of us are still here - maybe we need to get a life. (Kidding) All the best to you and yours for 2006. |
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New member Username: Proper_vinylPost Number: 1 Registered: Jan-06 | Great discussion guys, and really a great review as well. Just two questions. First, is it possible to connect a powered subwoofer to this preamp/amp combo? Thanks |
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Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 2595 Registered: Feb-05 | Yes, the C162 has 2 sets of pre outs making it easy to connect a powered sub at the line level. One set of pre outs is adjustable and the other is fixed. |
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