The" Ling" Thing ...a womans point of view.
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 25 Registered: Aug-05 | Well hello everyone..it's my turn!! My expertise is zero. My comments here are those of an average music lover with a fondness for the equipment... who happens to be female. I've been listening to the Lings for a few hours now and I am impressed. To begin with they are beautiful. The workmanship is lovely, all of it, they even have gold plated speaker connectors (we girls do love jewelery). The wood veneer is gorgeous and wrapped around the entire box. Take off the grill cover and instead of the standard black background to the drivers there is this nice wood. This contrast shows off these expensive drivers very well. (I am not going to discribe the larger driver with the copper..er..cone in the center.) There is also a very nice "Alegria" badge. Tim I would suggest another badge or logo of some kind on the grill covers. Perhaps very subtle, just the "A" maybe. These are very attractive speakers, the photos on the web page don't do them justice. The sound is easy. It is rich and full and easy to listen to. I've played Ray Charles, James Taylor, Nora Jones, Diana Krall, Elton John, and BB King to name a few. And a lot of radio. My ears never got tired. The sound is very natural. Very sleepy will write more later. |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 26 Registered: Aug-05 | OK My set up is very simple the Lings are sitting on my JBLs (45lb) so they are on a solid base and are toed in. I've had them connected to a Sansui B-3000 power amp and the B&K MC-101 preamp. Also the B&K tuner and an average CD player. I find the bass and midrange to be outstanding. A 4 1/2 driver...where is this comming from. At first I thought a lot of the upper end was missing. But after listening for a while I realized that it's there just softer or less intense than I am used to. These babies have a personality that is new to me. Tim, I may be hearing (or not) what you had in mind starting with the single driver design. The music is uncluttered. There is a "pure" quality that I don't know how to discribe. Yes, there is a black back ground of silence. Yes, they are engaging/involving but in a very gentle way. They don't force you to listen they allow you to hear. I have not tried very complex music yet, not a lot of female voices. I haven't connected them to the Mac eather. I'm starting to blather so ..I'll be back! Any questions? |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 27 Registered: Aug-05 | My music room is not large 15x25 maybe and no HT. The stereo is on the long wall. Carpet, drapes, a couch. Not a difficult room. The Lings do a nice job of filling the room with sound. They won't produce quanities of sound that will scorch your ears but they do allow more volume than necessary in this room. The Lings soundstage is spot on.( I hope I remembered the correct term.) The position of instruments and voices is defined and well proportioned to the listener. Not too close, not too far back, not bunched or overly spread out. The piano and player/vocal are together. Very true or accurate. I connected a small set of Sansui speakers. Lings blew them away. I connected a small set of Boston Acoustics. Lings blew them away also. Now I have a small set of KEFs connected through a Niles speaker switch with volume controls. No volume adjustment is needed. These two are comparable. Brian also brought over his Marantz 4300. Let ya know how it goes. |
|
Silver Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 838 Registered: Sep-04 | Margie, Siting the Lings on top of other speakers (your JBLs?) will affect the sound. Normally, the passive speakers will vibrate in sympathy, irrespective of the fact they could be a lot heavier. Since the JBLs are acting as an energy sink, they'll still do it. In terms of sound you could get a sympathetic result or you could not. The point of this post is that the siting of the Lings means you are not listening to them as they were designed to be heard. It's unlikely that people would have two sets of speakers, one on top of the other, as a long term solution. Is there no way you could sit them on their own stands? And preferably move the JBLs out of the way - I know, they're heavy! Regards, Frank. |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 500 Registered: Dec-03 | Thanks Margie! I think you've done well at describing the sound. Easy, gentle, pure, uncluttered, good imaging but not SPL monsters. Just as I was hoping, a "personal" stereo. |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 29 Registered: Aug-05 | Thanks Frank When I got them I put them on the big speakers for temporary convenience and I was in a hurry to hear them. Then they sounded so good I didn't think it would make much difference just leaving them there. I was wrong. I read your message and moved the JBLs out of the way and put the Lings on a pair of speaker stands. It didn't change the sound it just opened them up. They do like to breath. The sound is bigger. More volume, more bass, mid, and high. They really do fill the room and they did before. Tim....why didn't you say something? Also I think I may have left the wrong impression as to their volume capability. They can be played loud. Room filling without any distortion. I like music loud sometimes. I also play music fairly loud so I can run around down here and do house work etc. They will do that very well. "Personal stereo" ...Yes they certainly fit that requirement but I think that sells them a little short. Maybe I don't understand what you mean. I had a small HT (5.1) system a few years ago and liked it but I found that didn't use it much. I can see the Lings as great for that purpose. With their imaging and really accurate sound....that's what I'd do. The old Marantz 4300 was a Quad unit from the 70's. You can switch it to 100 watts or 40 watts. We tried both. The Lings liked the personality of Marantz a lot. A little mellower than the more agressive sound of the B&K. The Lings like the B&K too. I have them connected to the Mac (6100) now and I like this the best. Enough for now. |
|
Silver Member Username: T_bomb25Dayton, Ohio United States Post Number: 898 Registered: Jun-05 | pretty good Margie,you have some pretty nice gear to feed them as far as preamp amps go.So what are you using as your source? |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 503 Registered: Dec-03 | Just letting the chips fall where they may. Jan spent a lot of time with set-up and it sure seems like he got it right, however, every room is different and every listener is different. To some 80db is loud, or at least loud enough. For others 90db is where they like it. You Mac owners may be on to something. |
|
Silver Member Username: AudioholicPost Number: 116 Registered: Apr-05 | Frank, good job pointing out the speaker on speaker deal. Good speaker stands are worth every penny they cost. Now Margie, you might want to remove those JBL's and any other speakers you have from the room. Only one pair at a time in the listening room ok? |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5480 Registered: May-04 | Margie - Did you find the sheet I sent along with the speakers? I gave some suggestions for set up. I figured you would place them on your JBL's for simplicity and convenience at first. If you have no speaker stands, a few dollars spent on some concrete blocks will suffice for the length of time you will have the Lings. When you purchase a pair, T8 can give you a deal on some stands. Then you'll have a few concrete blocks to use as a start on that raised bed garden you've been thinking about installing in the back yard. |
|
Silver Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 844 Registered: Sep-04 | Margie, glad I could help. I hope you had some help moving the JBLs out of the way...! Tim, learn to sell your speakers!  Regards, Frank. |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 506 Registered: Dec-03 | I'm seriously considering including tip-toes with the Lings. Seems like a minimal investment for the improvement. |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5494 Registered: May-04 | Tim - Try this. Since I didn't want to mar the cabinets on the Lings, I didn't experiment and used the TipToes I had on hand. If you have the ability to place sockets for spikes, or for that matter just a firm, solid indentation, in the Ling's cabinets, try them with medium dimension ball bearings instead of TipToes. The socket or indentation will fix the ball in place on the underside of the cabinet and the ball will situate itself on the supporting surface by contacting a very small point (a tangent) between the surface of the shelf and the ball bearing. This should give the same effect as the TipToes and at far less expense. The additional feature/benefit/advantage would be ball bearings will not scratch the supporting surface if the Lings get placed on a shelf while still providing the same support and structural stability of the more expensive TipToes. I don't think the mechanical diode effect of the TipToes is what benefitted my placement options. I think it was just freeing the speaker from the draining effects of PlastiTak'ing the cabinets to a damped stand. But, I think the stand must be stable and damped; just don't let it damp the speaker cabinet. With large ball bearings available at most hardware shops, you could provide the socket and allow the customer to decide the cost they wanted to incur as an aftermarket upgrade. BTW, I used three TipToes under each speaker. Two up front and one in the rear. Be sure to supply a sheet of paper towel and a piece of plywood too. The ply can become part of the packaging materials. How clever can we get? |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5495 Registered: May-04 | Make a quick revision to the above and try this. I placed the Lings on the ply and the spikes under the ply at one point. Try it with the ball bearings supporting the ply in this arrangement and the p.t. between the speaker and the ply. This should make it easier to fit the ball bearings and can even become a "factory approved" upgrade to all existing Ling products. Now you're in the upgrade business too! |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 507 Registered: Dec-03 | Sounds like fun! I'll be experimenting. When you mentioned ball bearings I thought of these. http://www.fimpression.com/detail.aspx?ID=92 They are pretty cool but a little pricey for this application. Winston makes an excellent platform using these ball bearings and cups that's very nice. |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5500 Registered: May-04 | Yes ... well ... that's the idea. I just had in mind a price of around $4.98. But then, what the heck, you wouldn't be a high end manufacturer at that price; would you? |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5501 Registered: May-04 | "Six pucks, three steel ball bearings of 3/8" diameter and an instruction sheet." It's almost worth ordering just to read the instruction sheet. I wish it were a full blown manual. |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 475 Registered: May-05 | Margie, Wonderful review so far. I am impressed with the diversity of equipment and music. What did you think of the Lings using differing music genre and voices? Have you tried any classical or rock and what did you think of it? We should have sent these things to Jan first and then I could have copied his set-up instructions. BTW, I'm in the process of trying to sell a NIB Omega watch and my old HT system to free up some money for an amp or amp/pre amp and I think I'm going to take Tim up on his $299 offer for dedicated Lings for the 2 channel. What think you, Tim? Keep up the review, Margie. So far, very good. |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 32 Registered: Aug-05 | Long day... sorry I'm so late. TW I do have some good stuff but almost without exception it's old or vintage..grin My weakness is the CD player. My son buys fixes and sells stereo components as a hobby so my CD is a brand that was in the "Home Audio" business in the 80's. They made some nice pieces but desided not to continue by 1990. Kyocera also did some mfg. for Nakamichi during this time. I like the sound of mine, the DA-610, better than the older Naks and NADs. It's nice, average and will do fine 'till I come up with the cash to buy something really good. Paul...OK (Now I have a very large set of Sansui speakers in my kitchen. JBLs in the bathroom...) Jan Confession time. I did get your set up instructions and read them even. But I was in a hurry to hear the the sweet babies and then I got interested in the recipe.....and they sounded sooo good. I have several sets of speaker stands in different sizes. I do know better. I have hardwood floors and you can't set a speaker directly on them without the speakers sounding...bad. I'm sorry. Frank My hand trucks name is Brian. He knows better too. They just sounded so good... Dave I have been very lucky. I have had all of the info from all ya'll before me. Also I got them just before the long holiday weekend so I've been spending a lot of time getting to know them. You ask about "differing music genre and voices". I knew that I was unfamiliar with the design of the Lings. Those before me found lower tones, male voices and simple compositions to be strengths of the Lings. It seemed fair to start there. I then started changing the amps. and other small speakers. I was adding more variety to the music selections as well. By now I have played many. But I must say good night for now, I'll be back tomorrow. |
|
Silver Member Username: AudioholicPost Number: 118 Registered: Apr-05 | Margie, sorry bout the speakers in the bathroom thing....but they had to go. I believe the Lings are a 1st order crossover system (someone correct me if i'm wrong) so naturally the midrange is going to be smoother, less phase distortion. You may want to look into other companies doing 1st order units. Two come to mind that are affordable: Meadowlark and Green Mountain Audio. The former is out of business, so great deals should abound. The latter has a cult like following in most audio forums second to none. A friend I trust completely recently heard them and cannot stop singing there praises. Though I have not heard either, both have been doing first order units a long time, with much sucess. Reviewers also seem to love them. Good luck. |
|
Silver Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 851 Registered: Sep-04 | Tim My experience with 'bookshelf' (horrible tag) speakers is that they generally work better when blutak'd to an appropriate stand. The ball bearing approach which you can easily test with 3 nuts and 3 ball bearings of appropriate size under each speaker (each ball bearing sits on a nut) seems to mess up the bass timing in my view. There are bound to be exceptions but I would tread warily... Regards, Frank. |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 508 Registered: Dec-03 | "What think you, Tim?" I've got a pair right here for you David. |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5516 Registered: May-04 | Frank _ I tried the speakers in several locations and in many configurations of speaker stands and mounting. Not once did I think the Lings sounded best when tied down to a damped stand. You can read my write up for more information, if you like. It's on the forum under "Write a Review". Naturally, since the current conventional wisdom is to make the speakers and stands as much one immobile unit as possible by employing BluTak, that's how I began listening to the Lings. Here is where I see many people making mistakes in their system set up. They do what they have read works for one system (or many systems) and do not consider that their system is unique and possibly their set up requirements will also be unconventional. Someone had to be the first to put BluTak under a speaker. Someone had to be the first to put a LP12 on a flimsy table. Someone had to be the first to charge outrageous amounts for a tweak they discovered while setting up their system. That person thought about what sounded best for their system. They found it worked well in many instances and made a recommendation. Too many listeners go through the motions of set up as they have read in the "how to" instructions of the magazines and don't understand why their equipment doesn't give that "jaw dropping, holographic soundstaging" that they read about in the magazine review. Possibly, if they did some work and listened to the results instead of blindly following convention, they would find a little thought would get what they paid their money for. When the Lings were Tak'd down to a damped stand in any of my systems they sounded closed down and somewhat dull in this configuration. So I started to experiment and ended up with the paper towel, plywood and TipToes arrangement that I describe in the article. I went back and forth several times in each system to make sure I wanted to make the recommendation; and each time I heard the same qualities when the speakers were tied down or left free to sing. It's clear why a larger speaker placed on spikes gives better performnce. If you view the damped, spiked speaker stand as a floor that has been raised to the level of the speaker, then spikes under a smaller speaker should, in many cases, provide the same benefits. I see this as a try and listen situation and one that worked nicely during my time with the Lings. Everybody gets to set up their system the way they prefer, but with the Lings, I would strongly suggest you try the TipToes before you just go Tak'ing stuff down. P.B. - The Lings have a first order XO. But, it is not in the conventional territory of the midrange. It is placed much higher in frequency and that is part of what makes the Ling unlike most other speakers out there, bookshelf or otherwise. In Tim's speaker the single, near full range 4.5" driver is fed most of the 9 octaves out of ten the speaker will have to deal with. Click on T8's username and find his web site for a more complete picture of how the Ling has been designed. |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5523 Registered: May-04 | "Thread: The" Ling" Thing ...a womans point of view." Ya'know, Margie. You get to name your thread anything you like. But doesn't that kinda make this sound like it's gonna be a Midol commercial?sf |
|
Anonymous | it's not a Midol commercial until Paul chimes in with his usual idiotic comments. |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 33 Registered: Aug-05 | Oh Jan Just stab me in the heart why don't ya. I thought about "My fling with the Lings" but that sounded too much like an alternate life style. Two of them, one of me..that makes three...no probably not. I also wanted all you male types to know what you were getting into from the start. I understand "Guy Speak" some but It's not my first language. BTW what is the little sf about? |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5532 Registered: May-04 | smiley face. I just hate that little picture. It gives me the creeps. |
|
Bronze Member Username: LovegasolineNYC Post Number: 48 Registered: Jul-05 | What exactly IS BluTak? A friend whom (who?) I helped move not too long ago gave me a bunch of stuff....far and wide ranging stuff, and included was about half a dozen packages of stuff called 'Fun•Tak' made by DAP. Each pack has 4 strips of a 2"x1/2"x1/8" (approx.) light blue colored chewing gum like substance. States it's a reusable, removable adhesive. Is this the stuff? What is the general layout when using it to fix speakers? Is it really removable, or does it stain with time? Also says not to take internally. |
|
Silver Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 863 Registered: Sep-04 | Yes that's the stuff. Blutak is the original brand name. It's the same scenario as people talking about a Hoover when meaning a vacuum cleaner or the Tannoy when meaning the Public Address system. Regards, Frank. |
|
Silver Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 864 Registered: Sep-04 | incidentally, there's a manic stronger stickier version called black tak. If you decide to use it be careful. I've heard of people stripping veneer off their speakers with the stuff. It really is very effective indeed. And yes, it's black. Jan, thanks for the information about the arrangement with siting the Lings. It's rare for a speaker to be better like this, but not completely unheard of. Regards, Frank. |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 34 Registered: Aug-05 | Back to the music. We have spent a lot of time over on "Do you listen?" discussing properties of music. How does "live" music sound? How much of that sound and which parts do you want in your components at home? There will be compromises. What do you want vs what you are willing to give up to get it. Tims Lings are causing me to think about all of this again. I haven't heard speakers of this design before. It is accurate, true, and natural. It is the closest to the sound of live music that I have become acquainted with. I put it that way because it is new to my ear. Probably the difference between sound that is more and now less "fooled around with". Dave, you ask about the different music that I have listened to. I started easy to let my ear get the sound of these speskers where I expected them to be strong. By now I've listened to Bonnie Raitt, Trisha Yearwood, Juice Newton, Tanya Tucker, The Dixie Chicks, Garth Brooks, Hal Ketchum, Ronnie Milsap, Roy Orbison ...some country...my least favorite type of music. Loreena McKennitt, Sarah Brightman, Barbra Streisand, Sheryl Crow, Nora Jones, Linda Ronstadt, Tracy Chapman,....some female voices. More tomorrow. |
|
Silver Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 873 Registered: Sep-04 | er...no classical? Jazz? Where's the Stan Getz, Miles Davis, Oscar Peterson??? Come on girl, I expect a woman on this forum to have taste! (Just yanking your chain right? ) Oh and for killer timing, some Paco De Lucia flamenco guitar or Al Di Meola perhaps. Regards, Frank. |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 511 Registered: Dec-03 | Too bad there isn't classical music with vocalists. Oh, wait.....there's a name for that....hmmm... |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5561 Registered: May-04 | "Happy Birthday" That's a classic. |
|
Gold Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 1814 Registered: Mar-05 | Margie, if you have it in your CD collection, please listen to some symphonies, string quartets, and especially pipe organ music on the Lings, and tell us what you think. These were the areas where I was least happy withn the Lings. With vocal pop/rock they did very well at moderate volumes (under 75db). |
|
Silver Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 876 Registered: Sep-04 | Hang on - pipe organ music? blimey, that's a big ask of an inky dinky pair of standmounts. In fact, it's usually a big ask of anything that's an ordinary size... Regards, Frank. |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 514 Registered: Dec-03 | Pipe organ music on a 4.5" driver is a bit much if you're not rolling the low bass to a sub. BTW, there's been some updates on my site if you care to check it out. |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5574 Registered: May-04 | Don't tell me - you're giving away free speakers to everyone that auditions them???? |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 515 Registered: Dec-03 | Eh....well..no, not exactly. |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 482 Registered: May-05 | Hey, where do I sign up for the free speakers? I think that last effort at free speakers was with T-Man's SDATs. BTW, how do you guys like your free SDATs? What you didn't get yours? LOL Margie, I'll send you some Mo-tab choir with their honkin' pipe organ if you want to audition it? Or, you could try a more traditional Bach Toccata & Fugue in D Minor. (How come nobody ever does anything in D Major, huh? I really miss D Major.) |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5585 Registered: May-04 | D-major is busy at the moment. Would you like to speak to d-colonel? |
|
Silver Member Username: T_bomb25Dayton, Ohio United States Post Number: 926 Registered: Jun-05 | David they are still at SDATs warehouse,but for the reviewers Tim said $299 right? or do you have a better deal for us Tim come on let us hear new good news Tim. |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 485 Registered: May-05 | Hey T-Man, $399 regular and on sale to "reviewers" for $299, given the cost of the components, is pretty dang good news. As for you colonel Klink Vigne, d pointed is what I was with that one, LOL. Margie, great selection of music. Tell us what you're hearing and what you're feeling. Please leave out any details on your clothing, the last time you did that we had quite a stir, I'm afraid. Plus, I may never get that image of Jan out of mind, HELP. NOW, I'M REALLY LOL. |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 35 Registered: Aug-05 | Frank You don't trust me ...I'm crushed! Not much Jazz...no taste...none at all. Sorry ED No pipe organ, bagpipes yes... haunting Chants too. Beautiful, really awe inspiring. Dave Yes please, send disks. The Everly Brothers, Beach Boys, Crosby Stills & Nash...The point here is the vocal harmony. The Lings are perfect for this. Each voice is separate, clear, true with the total blended...Yum, sweet. The Kingston Trio, The Mamas and the Papas, The Beatles, The Stones (Their Sa-tanic Majesties Request restored in 2004, the two layers for reg CD and SACD), folk music (Arlo Guthrie etc). This was really old stuff. Some were old recordings transfered to CD a decade or more ago, some transfered with new methods. The Lings allowed the music to be heard. What fun. Revisiting old memories. They sound good! Guitar,Lute,Harp,Cello,Flute,Saxophone,Piano....Andrea Bocelli, Pavarotti, Josh Groban, Sarah Brightman, Rene Fleming....Beethovens #9, Rachmaninov #2, Bolero, Copland #3, Gershwin, Chopin, Liszt, Stravinsky, Dvorak, Vivaldi and Tchaikovsky. All of this was very enjoyable. Some of these are complex compositions. I think it is the compact size of the Lings that finds the complex ones most difficult. Am I correct? Dave....White....feathers |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5596 Registered: May-04 | Margie - You old hippie. Got any bootleg Dylan? Pete Seeger? The Lings did an excellent job of getting their music right when I had them? They cut through the crappy recording and you hear the meaning of the words as if you've never heard the song before. |
|
Silver Member Username: T_bomb25Dayton, Ohio United States Post Number: 936 Registered: Jun-05 | If its a good design a 2 way should be able to dissect the music and have great rythum and timing and have your feet tapping.Margie try some Fourplay if you have some,all of their recordings are flawless and Bob James is one of the best musicians of our time.Hey David it didnt hurt to try $299 is a sriking deal they may the best value in speakers on the market their specs and parts sure isnt a $299 speaker. |
|
Gold Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 1818 Registered: Mar-05 | > Pipe organ music on a 4.5" driver is a bit much if you're not rolling the low bass to a sub. I believe I did listen to Bach's Toccata and Fugue on the Lings and the Ascends while crossed over at 80Hz on my Marantz to a sub. This was the Ling's low point during my audition, just as Bach's Brandenburg piano pieces and Villa Lobos' Spanish guitar were their high points. > BTW, there's been some updates on my site if you care to check it out. Thanks, the Rosa looks very interesting. How would you describe the effect of having an extra woofer? I noticed that sensitivity has increased by 3db over the Lings, but was suprised that the frequency response numbers are identical. Also I didn't remember the Lings being listed with a 60Hz low end, I thought it was 50 or maybe even 40Hz? Their bass extension definitely sounded a heck of a lot lower than 60Hz! |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 488 Registered: May-05 | T-Man, hey, I'll never blame you for trying, big guy. Plus, Tim may need to have a sale to clear out some of the Lings to make way for Emma's debut. When does Emma hit the road, Tim? |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 36 Registered: Aug-05 | Jan I don't consider myself old. ...grin Seeger, Peter Paul & Mary, Dylan, love Dylan. Yes, you said it well. The Lings make the age or quailty of the recording unimportant. They present the music, as it was intended. TW Did I get this right. Are you recomending that I try some fourplay? |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 490 Registered: May-05 | Bad Margie, bad Margie. LOL You go from black leather to white feathers and have an eclectic music collection, for sure. Sounds like you're enjoying the Lings and that's a good thing. However, I've got to take Tim to task. I went to his revised site and no Emma. Instead, there's now a Rosa and she goes both ways, center or left/right. Now, that's a speaker I may need to meet. I'm afraid Emma may be history T-Man. LOL |
|
Silver Member Username: AudioholicPost Number: 129 Registered: Apr-05 | Margie, What your hearing in the Lings is the crossover not mucking up the structural integrety of the waveform as most speakers do. This is due to the 1st order design. Tawaun said "If its a good design a 2 way should be able to dissect the music and have great rythum and timing and have your feet tapping" No, only if it's a first order design. Good drivers and good crossover parts do not always equate to great speakers. Only a 1st order crossover can be time coherant. Your hearing that now. Again, I urge you to listen to some companies that do nothing but 1st order units (more time/research spent on perfecting it) before buying anything. Time well spent. If you want more information on how the crossover affects what you hear, i'd be happy to provide you some websites, etc. Just ask. |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5599 Registered: May-04 | P.B. - I don't think you're catching on to the design of the Lings. You keep talking about the XO mucking things up. Please look at Tim's webpage and find where the actual XO point is placed on the Lings. What you hear through the bottom nine octaves of music has virtually nothing to do with how the XO is designed. Also, if you are going to beat the drum for a first order XO, you might give the disadvantages of the design. We all have our favorite ideas we find agreeable to our ears, but thinking one or the other is the key to good sound is unwise. |
|
pu_pu_platter Unregistered guest | Mmm, I would make a guess that the Lings aren't actually time coherent. I bet I'd like the Lings - I've heard lots of great sounding 1st otder designed speakers, some time-coherent, some not. I'm interested in the Lings more for WHERE the drivers cross over, than the slope itself (although if I had to pick, I'd design a speaker with a 1st order, just for the record). |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 517 Registered: Dec-03 | The FR numbers I post for my speakers are conservative. They may actually play lower depending on the room. Adding a second (same) woofer does not give you more bass extension. It does effect sensitivity (depending on how it's wired), changes the polar dispersion pattern and will require a change to the crossover design as well. For the Rosa LCR the intent was to gain SPL output and create a wider (or taller) dispersion pattern for use in home theater. Emma is currently on the back burner, sorry guys. I've been working intently on a custom floorstanding design for a customer that should find it's way into the line-up as a regular product. I'm also working on another floorstander model to demo at CES. Jan is correct. There is no crossover in the mid-range of the Lings. XO point is ~10kHz. |
|
Silver Member Username: T_bomb25Dayton, Ohio United States Post Number: 938 Registered: Jun-05 | Paul B. is getting to caught up in the first order x-over thing,hey Ive heard first order xover time coherent,speakers I didnt like for instance the Vandersteen 2,3 way to warm and slugish and slow overly warm.Paul a good design is a good design regardless of what it is,so PB are you coming over here to screw up this thread with your screwed up philosphy.You did just say in this thread good drivers and x-overs dont always equate into agreat speaker,but you looked on Odysseys website and looked at the drivers on the Epiphonys and you said nothing special they cant be that.Look man stop making yourself look stupid you claim a 1st order x-over is your only fancy oh wait a minute the only fancy for speaker design,but yet as long as we have been talking about the Lings you were not even aware that they were a 1st order x-over,gimme a break you have no clue 35 years experiance my as.,if your experience was that vast you know that other designs do work.Hey guys this dude doesent even hear speakers he only reads about them,he has no idea what sounds good he is to caught in reviewers hype.A $20,000 Aerial 20T isnt a 1st order x-over so I guess it cant be right either huhh? |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5604 Registered: May-04 | "I would make a guess that the Lings aren't actually time coherent. I bet I'd like the Lings ... " I'll try to ask as politely as possible; what the F are you talking about? The lower nine octaves are handled by one driver with a 6dB XO at about 10k. How time coherent do you want? As to you comment that implies you would like speakers that are not time coherent .... ?! That's all I can say - ?! I don't want to appear too rude on Margie's thread. But, if you don't know what you are talking about, why settle here? There are plenty of threads on this forum that accept answers from people who have no idea what thy're talking about. Why not try one of those? |
|
Silver Member Username: T_bomb25Dayton, Ohio United States Post Number: 941 Registered: Jun-05 | Jan he is to busy with his head up Paul Brolins as.Jan if you think this stupid what he said on this thread go over to my thread this dude has no clue.He was so caught up on Paul Brolins measurments that he missed it when he said the Legacy Focus 20/20 were the best speaker he had ever heard for 6k. |
|
pu_pu_platter Unregistered guest | I'm just pointing out that Paul Bayless said "Only a 1st order crossover can be time coherant. Your hearing THAT now." I'm just clarifying that the Lings PROBABLY are not time coherent, not that it matters. Sure the main driver goes up to 10K, there is still a lot of info that is handled by the tweeter that might be hitting your ears earlier than the lo freq driver. Anyway, who cares. I WAS stuck on the time coherent thing for quite somtime. I haven't seen a step response measurement of my current speakers, and although they're crossed over like the Lings, I don't know if they're time coherent or not - I like them and don't care. When I saw the Lings I was intrigued because Tim's design is how I always thought about designing a small speaker - that's what I meant by if I designed a speaker it would be 1st order. |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5607 Registered: May-04 | Well, Okey Dokey then! Can anybody tell me what he just said? If he doesn't care, why go on about it? |
|
Silver Member Username: AudioholicPost Number: 132 Registered: Apr-05 | Tawaun, since you pretend to have all the "right answers" and proclaimed I have no idea what i'm talking about, please provide me some proof of what I said that is wrong. Physics backs up every one of my claims. I just re-posted on your thread you claim i'm screwing up. Find some non factual statements there and post some solid physics evidence that i'm wrong, ok? The Aerials indeed cannot be "right" using a high order crossover. Simple as that Tawaun. Learn some more and you'll see that i'm correct. Is it ok to like high order speakers? Sure. Is it ok to say they are right or accurate reproducers of music? No, it is not. Look at what a higher order crossover does to the original musical waveform in the site below and tell me how you or anyone else can consider that either "right" or an accurate reproducer of music? http://www.soundstage.com/maxdb/maxdb081999.htm |
|
Silver Member Username: AudioholicPost Number: 133 Registered: Apr-05 | Jan, I think Tim is doing a fine job and is one designer who is on the right track. Keep up the good work Tim. |
|
pu_pu_platter Unregistered guest | What is your problem? When did I ever attack you? If I'm missing something, why don't you constructively say it? TRY not to be rude on Margie's thread. |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 518 Registered: Dec-03 | Thank you Paul. Say, earlier in this thread there were some recordings/artists listed. I'd like to recommend a couple of recordings that end up being played on my system quite often lately. 1. Sara K. "Hobo" on Chesky Records - 96/24 SuperAudioDisk. This is one of those recordings that makes many others sound pathetic. 2. Beth Orton "Daybreaker" on Heavenly Records - Vinyl. I got lucky and picked this up one day when I was shopping record stores on The Ave. If you come across this recording snap it up quick and forever pat yourself on the back for being so wise. |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 493 Registered: May-05 | Sorry Margie, I'm hijacking your thread while we have Tim's attention. Tell me how Emma will differ from Rosa. I know you were talking about adding another 4.5" driver in the Emma and that seems to be what you've done in Rosa. And, give us a little peak at this new floorstander, what's in the cards with that puppy. Share, it's good for the soul, Tim. Thanks, Dave |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5612 Registered: May-04 | Hey, I said Okey Dokey. What more do you want? |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 519 Registered: Dec-03 | David: How does Emma differ from Rosa LCR? Emma uses a 6" mid-woof and a high-end dome tweeter and is a "full range" speaker capable of 30Hz to 20kHz +/-3db. Rosa LCR is a d'Appolito type mid-tweet-mid that started life as the center channel for a Ling home theater but became an LCR (left-center-right) speaker after some tweaking of the XO. Emma is intended to be a two-channel system monitor while the Rosa LCR is aimed primarily at HT. I desribed the new floorstander in Jan's thread titled "Do you think". I've copied my statement from that thread here. "Actually it's a "bipole" TL variant. Bipole assumes the drivers are wired in phase (push-push), dipole assumes either open baffle or the drivers wired out of phase (push-pull). I only have the prototypes right now. The final cabinet assembly will happen next week. I'll have pictures soon. I'm using two 4.5" drivers, one firing forward, the other firing to the rear, wired in phase. The forward driver is "full range" (+\-3db 65Hz - 20kHz) and the rear driver is "wide range" (+\-3db 65Hz - 12kHz). There is NO crossover. The cabinet is a TL variant, technically a "restricted terminus quarter-wave resonator" with a series of internal chambers to control the backwave velocity and pressure. Typically in this type of design the driver will be placed near the center of the line leaving a chamber above the driver that's nearly the same size as the space below the driver. The cabinet is then filled appropriately with some type of stuffing, either polyester wool or fiberglass. As resonances set up inside the cabinet the frequencies tend to "stack up" with the higher frequencies staying in the upper portion and being slowed by the stuffing and the lower frequencies making their way down to the base where there is usually a port. In my design the driver has been placed near the top of the cabinet and the series of chambers below the driver perform the function of slowing the upper frequencies and passing the low frequencies to the port. The length and cross-sectional area of the cabinet still provides the benefits of quarter-wave resonance giving me a nice boost in bass response. This has resulted in a very livable size cabinet that's about 40" tall. " It's quite a remarkable speaker that I'm estimating will sell for about $850 per pair. It's intended to be used in a two channel system that allows for some freedom of placement in a room. In my room I've found them to work best about 2' from the wall, 7' apart and 9' from the listening area. The bass response is startling and few speakers disappear as these do. I've not settled for sure on a name although I'm considering Myra which means "song". |
|
pu_pu_platter Unregistered guest | Jan, I just wanted to know why you attacked me like you did. Among your thousands of posts, I have NEVER attacked you. |
|
Anoynymous Unregistered guest | Come on guys, please respect the lady's thread. Margie, Just two words...."Great Job"....really ! |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 37 Registered: Aug-05 | I still have some thoughts I need to post but that will have to wait untill tomorrow. I have tried to give you a representative sample of the the types of music and artist I've listened to. I would have loved to have kept them longer. But my time ran out. I didn't feel that it would have been productive for them to stay with me any longer. So TW, they are on their way! I shipped them out on Friday the 9th. They are traveling USPS ground. (I trust them more than UPS with anything that needs special handling.) Their trip will last 6 days, that's business days of course, and they do not count yesterday even though I turned over custody by 9:00 AM . They should arrive on Friday the 16th. |
|
Silver Member Username: AudioholicPost Number: 135 Registered: Apr-05 | Tim, do you use a Zobel network on your crossover? |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5617 Registered: May-04 | PB - Click on Tim's username to get to his web page, the information is there. ppp - I didn't attack you. I disagreed with you. What you posted made no sense. I tried to point that out. Quite honestly, you still are making no sense. That's not an attack - that's just a fact. This is not the place for the discussion, but why would you probably like a speaker that wasn't time coherent? You might; that is not the point. Time coherence alone is not the only key to good speaker performance. If you judge speakers ... I'm sorry, if you get stuck on time coherence and step response measurements ... aren't you missing the forest for the trees? To suggest a speaker probably isn't time coherent and then proclaim you might like them based on that fact ... I don't know. Does that make sense to anyone else? Sorry, Margie. |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 521 Registered: Dec-03 | No Zobel. |
|
pu_pu_platter Unregistered guest | One more then I'll let it go. It's funny that you mention the forest for the trees, because looking at the big picture is exactly what I did when I bought my current speakers. All I was saying with my first post was that Paul gets stuck on the time coherent thing. I never said that I would like a speaker BECAUSE it was not time coherent - most just happen to be, and it's ok. Also, if you read carefully, I said that I WAS stuck on the time coherent concept. "We all have our favorite ideas we find agreeable to our ears, but thinking one or the other is the key to good sound is unwise." Can we just end it with that? That was what I was getting at, but not as clearly as I had hoped... Apologies... |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5625 Registered: May-04 | Well, Okey Dokey then! |
|
Silver Member Username: T_bomb25Dayton, Ohio United States Post Number: 945 Registered: Jun-05 | Thanks Margie I hope had a good time with them I know I will.Paul look man I have a hard time taking you seriously because you dont judge speakers on sound,you judge by measurements and 1st order crossovers,Im smart enough to know that those things alone wont ensure good performance,you buddy are very very narrow minded and in audio thats a no no,but I think I know everything thats what say,well one thing that I do know the sound is what counts the most everything else in a speaker is secondary.So you can keep specs as your best source to choose speakers and one of these days Ill have a inaccurate speaker like the Aerial 20T and be the happiest guy on earth while your sitting around preaching the same horsesh1t that your saying now someone who doesent listen needs to keep their mouth close and LISTEN!!!! |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 38 Registered: Aug-05 | Pulling it all together.... The Lings have the most natural sound that I've heard. The set up is very important. Once they have been positioned properly the Lings produce the full affect of the "live" performance. By that I mean the timing and imaging and quality of the sounds (instruments and voices) "feel" true. Examples: 1. There is a song Eric clapton and BB King do that starts with a knocking sound. I know it's there yet my head spinned to look at the door. 2. A group from Australia, The John Butler Trio, has unique and complex rhythm/tempo. Percussion, guitar, and voice. Difficult to get the full range of sounds, timing and the placement correct but the Lings did. 3. Sarah McLachlan "Mirrorball" a live recording done very well vs "Fallen" a studio recording. Both came through the Lings accurately. I could hear the differences, both were intmate, neither was wrong or untrue just different. 4. Joni mitchell..the song " Both Sides Now" one recorded in 1969 (were any of you alive then?) and again in 2002. The womans voice has change, aged over the years. I think her understanding of her own words as well. The Lings catch all the subtlety and nuance in both versions. 5. Chants and other acappella recordings..the Lings captured the acoustics of the environment and placed the voices within. Truly awe inspiring. 6. Bruce Springsteen, Lenny Kravitz, the rock genre...rocked! 7. Folk music and all the old music originally recorded on LP and transfered to CD. Even though the quality of the recordings is poor the Lings allowed the music to come through. Listening to them (the old recordings ) was fun. I wasn't annoyed by the lack of quality of the recording. 8. Classical music...the most difficult. The Lings do have some difficulty with the complex compositions. However, classical music is about stimulation. The mind, emotions, even physical stimulation and this the Lings do very well. I was touched, I thought, I got up and conducted, I even danced. Classical music sooths, it is uplifting, it is spiritual. The Lings allowed me to "feel" all of these. The Lings are excellent speakers. They are a different approach to quaility sound and it does take some time to fully appreciate. I'm not sure that a direct comparison of the Lings and any other "type" of speaker is even fair. A bit like apples and oranges. I have owned speakers with multiple drivers and crossovers, horns, radiators, ports, no ports, those requiring a little equilizer, different types of enclosures etc. All produce a sound that has "been fooled around with". I think one effect that is consistent across them all is an intensity. Yes it is less present in some over others. My point is that the Lings don't seem to have it at all. They are not aggressive. If you directly compare back and forth you tend to loose the strength of the Lings which is their natural sound. The Lings will let you hear the music that you choose as it was entended. My thanks to Tim for giving me this opportunity. I learned a great deal and had a great time. Margie |
|
Silver Member Username: Timn8terSeattle, WA USA Post Number: 523 Registered: Dec-03 | You're welcome Margie. Thank you for your very thoughtful comments. |
|
Silver Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 888 Registered: Sep-04 | Hey Margie, Nice selection of music! Much more impressed. Dancing in the lounge? Whatever next! Regards, Frank. |
|
Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 1666 Registered: Feb-05 | Well done Margie. Your conclusion made for a good read. |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 511 Registered: May-05 | Margie, WELL DONE!! Yes, I was alive in '69. In fact, I was in Mexico that summer and having a ball while getting ready to go to high school. I suspect Art, Jan and few others can relate. |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 39 Registered: Aug-05 | Sorry to have taken so long.. my computer had to be replaced. Frank Glad I have redeemed myself,..... a little. Art Thank you, I respect your opinions. Dave Thank you....Mexico, went there once...scary! |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5794 Registered: May-04 | You audition the Lings and your computer needs to be replaced? Coincidence? You decide! |
|
Jason W Unregistered guest | Thank you....Mexico, went there once...scary! Comment not well taken, what part of Mexico did you go to? You know that is a pretty good size country where you can find the most wonderful people and some of the most amazing places on earth; (if you know where yo go).I have visited several times and have had the most fun. I went to California once (L.A.).....Scary ! |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 44 Registered: Aug-05 | Jason My comment was made to a new friend. I intended it to be playfull. I meant no disparagement to the country or People of Mexico. Please understand that many of the members of this forum have a long history. It is easy to take a comment out of context and be offended by it. Escalation, then, may seem appropriate. No harm intended, Margie |
|
Jason W Unregistered guest | Margie, You are right, perhaps I over-reacted. You seem to be a nice lady, moreover, I think you are a great Person. Regards |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 528 Registered: May-05 | Margie, I'm actually probably your "old" friend. As for Mexico, I'm with Jason. I spent six weeks wondering from Juarez to Guaymas, to Culiacan to Mazatlan, to San Pietro to Mexico City and then back up the interior through Durango. It was an incredible trip, the people were fantastic and this was long before Mazatlan was a tourist locale. So, we found only wonderful people, had lazy days, way too much fun and it will always be remembered at the best misspent time of my youth, with a great friend and his family. Jason, lived in L.A. most of my life, "real scary". NOW, when does T-Man start reporting on the Lings? NO PRESSURE T - it's all been said, there's no more to say OR IS THERE? |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 533 Registered: May-05 | That should have been "wandering" not "wondering". |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 45 Registered: Aug-05 | I'm concerned. I made a comment, not a big one. I was responding to a small story of Daves. Dave and I share something. We both grew up in Southern California. His story referred to a trip he made to Mexico during a summer when he was in middle school. My comment was "...Mexico, went there once...scary!". My one trip to Mexico was the summer between sixth and seventh grade.( roughly the same age as Dave was when he took his trip). I went camping on the beach with the family of my girl friend. They had three daughters all close in age. They allowed each girl to bring one friend. So we were six girls from about eleven to thirteen years of age. We were young enough to not yet be too impressed with "being girls" so we played. The beach was beautiful and uncrowded (Southern California beaches are very crowed). The water was warm and we didn't care if we got our hair wet. It was a great trip! Dave had not given the details of his trip at the time that I chose the word "scary". However, growing up in the L.A. area lots of people vacationed in Mexico....and usually loved it! "Scary" was meant as irony not fear. And was referring to similarity of experence not really to Mexico as a country or people. Now Why would this one little comment cause confusion. And if someone wasn't sure what was meant why not simple ask "What did you mean by that?". I think I know the answer. I think this forum has become full of tension. Too many times people are jumped on for their opinions or the way they express themselves. Instead of the starting assumption being that no one means to insult, it has become... probably was meant to insult or degrade. So responses are defensive, and offensive. Am I correct or is this just the way men deal with each other when women aren't around? Lastly I am a woman of faith. I do not beleave that men or women, or people of one race or culture, or one faith or another, are superior to any other. I beleave we are all a part of Gods garden. It is our character that is important. I like the diversity amoung us. How interesting we are. |
|
Gold Member Username: ArtkAlbany, Oregon USA Post Number: 1757 Registered: Feb-05 | I for one believe you. You have always behaved in a dignified manner on this forum so I have no reason to believe otherwise. You are right, there is a great deal of tension on the forum now. It ebbs and flows here at ecoustics. |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 5839 Registered: May-04 | YEP! |
|
Silver Member Username: Frank_abelaBerkshire UK Post Number: 900 Registered: Sep-04 | <patronising-voice> There there Jan, calm down... </patronising-voice> Margie, don't sweat it. Fora go through phases. Perhaps it's a case of familiarity breeding contempt. Regards, Frank. |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 46 Registered: Aug-05 | Thanks Guys Margie |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 555 Registered: May-05 | Margie, I didn't take it as derogatory at all. However, I will say that you're probably lucky I didn't find the six of you young ladies with my friend, then it might have been SCARY, in every sense of the word. At that age and with those hormones a going, six young ladies and two young men, that would be scary. LOL Now, having let my mind wander back in time, probably inappropriately I might add, I have nothing but the utmost respect for you and couldn't agree with you more on your faith based life vision of people and how we should approach each other. I don't think it's the tension, I think it's the testerone that's gotten a little out of hand. Fortunately, Jan, Art and I are probably a little more on the lower testerone biased side of life than some others, although I hate to speak for Art or Jan on such a topic. (After all, we all know how Jan types on this site. LOL) Anyway, my point, don't sweat it, those who have played with you on here, read your posts and know your heart, know that it's big and unbiased. Gotta go, getting ready for SLC and audio listening. WOO HOO!!! |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 556 Registered: May-05 | Margie, (I'm posting this again because it didn't seem to take the first time.) I didn't take it as derogatory at all. However, I will say that you're probably lucky I didn't find the six of you young ladies with my friend, then it might have been SCARY, in every sense of the word. At that age and with those hormones a going, six young ladies and two young men, that would be scary. LOL Now, having let my mind wander back in time, probably inappropriately I might add, I have nothing but the utmost respect for you and couldn't agree with you more on your faith based life vision of people and how we should approach each other. I don't think it's the tension, I think it's the testerone that's gotten a little out of hand. Fortunately, Jan, Art and I are probably a little more on the lower testerone biased side of life than some others, although I hate to speak for Art or Jan on such a topic. (After all, we all know how Jan types on this site. LOL) Anyway, my point, don't sweat it, those who have played with you on here, read your posts and know your heart, know that it's big and unbiased. Gotta go, getting ready for SLC and audio listening. WOO HOO!!! |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 48 Registered: Aug-05 | Thanks Dave I really apreciate your post. Margie |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 574 Registered: May-05 | My pleasure, madame. So, where in Mexico did you wander with your frieds, OR, is that too long ago to remember? LOL |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 51 Registered: Aug-05 | Dave I remember the beach! It was some sort of camp ground or motor home park (a long time ago they were called motor homes and they were not as fancy as todays moble homes). It was rather primitive. I don't remember the name of it. We came down off the main road in a big "U" and we were there. We stayed in one motor home and a tent and a cabana. Not many other campers. We had the whole beach pretty much to ourselves. I was almost twelve so I don't remember too much beyond having great fun. Margie |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 604 Registered: May-05 | Margie, That description narrows it down to about 1200 miles of coastline from Guaymas to San Blas and every point in between. LOL I didn't get much farther south than San Blas which is on the coast and a little north of Mexico City. Great memories, though. Dave |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 59 Registered: Aug-05 | Dave Gee only 1200 miles I would have thought it was bigger than that...Grin. I really loved that beach. I liked the So. Cal beaches too but there were always so many people. The beaches up here are really beautiful and not crowded at all but the water is cold. Changes the whole idea of beach. Still, I spend time dressed warmer but still close to the power and majesty of the ocean. |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 625 Registered: May-05 | I was up in your neck of the woods in March and may be coming down to San Francisco in November or December if the Court won't let me appear by telephone. (I just filed a lawsuit for a client in San Francisco County.) I love the beach everywhere but no. cal. beaches, except maybe Santa Cruz, are closer to Oregon and Washington beaches than so. cal. beaches, which are closer to Mexico's. But, my guess is that we weren't 1200 miles apart as I spent about a week in Guaymas, about 600 miles south of Tijuana and about 10 days in Mazatlan, 1200 miles from Tijuana or so. |
|
Bronze Member Username: MargieNapa, California Post Number: 63 Registered: Aug-05 | Dave I just found this last post. If your going to be "in the city" let me take you to lunch. Margie |
|
New member Username: Steve6Orange, Ca Usa Post Number: 1 Registered: Nov-05 | I have never heard the speakers in question, but it is not at all unreasonable to assert that one of the reasons you like the sound so much is because you appreciate their appearance. They look warm and lovely, they sound warm and lovely. We are talking about senses, after all. |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 677 Registered: May-05 | Margie, If I get to the City in the next year, I'll give you a heads up and I'll buy you lunch and we'll negotiate on the place. LOL I have a client doing work on a house up in Napa and another in the Bodega Bay area. So, it may be closer to your home than the City, we'll see. Steve, they're better looking in person than the pictures. Even though they're not solid wood, the veneer is real wood and it's done very well. My wife liked the cabinets much better than the speakers I have. BTW, welcome to the forum. Dave |
|
Gold Member Username: Jan_b_vigneDallas, TX Post Number: 6595 Registered: May-04 | "They look warm and lovely, they sound warm and lovely." Take the name badge off all the speakers and they will all look very much the same. Close your eyes and they do not all sound the same. A bit too much psuedo-psychology, I think. |
|
Silver Member Username: DakulisSpokane, Washington United States Post Number: 679 Registered: May-05 | Jan, now be nice. That's his first post. We don't want to scare him away before he becomes indoctrinated. Hey, it took you about 300 posts to get me past the "too much psuedo-psychology" and to start paying attention to what i was hearing, although I still think you should do house calls. |
|
New member Username: Steve6Orange, Ca Usa Post Number: 2 Registered: Nov-05 | Actually, if I close my eyes, I visualize this:  what an allure.........and she seduced me tonight.......this is why credit cards were invented. |
|
Gold Member Username: Edster922Abubala, Ababala The Occupation Post Number: 2961 Registered: Mar-05 | nah, too many knobs. Wouldn't exactly kick her out of bed for eating cookies, though! LOL |
|
New member Username: Steve6Orange, Ca Usa Post Number: 3 Registered: Nov-05 | I have to admit........it's at least partially the LOOK of the thing. And the heft. and my Beloved Boy can play his crappy MP3's as I go for Mahler and Jane Monheit and Charlie Parker.  |
Main Forums
Today's Posts- Home Audio Forum
- A/V Receivers Forum
- Amps Forum
- Cassette Forum
- CD Players Forum
- CD Recorders Forum
- DAC & Transports Forum
- DVD-Audio & SACD Forum
- Equalizers Forum
- Integrated Amps Forum
- iPod Docks Forum
- MiniDisc Forum
- Mini Systems Forum
- Digital Music Systems Forum
- Phono Forum
- Preamps Forum
- Speakers Forum
- Subwoofers Forum
- Tuners Forum
- Home Video Forum
- Home Theater Forum
- Car Audio Forum
- Accessories Forum
- All Forum Topics