04 Accord help

 

New member
Username: Andrewb

Post Number: 1
Registered: Aug-04
I just bought a 2004 Accord DX and wanted to upgrade the stereo without going too crazy. I plan on keeping the head unit, since it's heavily integrated with the heat/AC controls. I'm going to add the XM radio module as well. I want to select speakers and amps that will give me the best sound keeping in mind the sound quality limitations of the head unit (which aren't too bad).

I'm looking at installing the Infinity Kappa 60.5cs for the front speakers and using some sort of 100 watt Amp that accepts line inputs. I was thinking of the JBL P-180.2 (90Wx2), Boss Chaos C450 (110Wx2), or Power Acoustik OV-520 (125Wx2). They seem to have pretty clean specs but I haven't any experience with them. The Kicker KX350.2 (110Wx2) also looks nice but is more pricey. Any recommendations would be appreciated (something not too expensive).

From what I read at the forum, rear speakers aren't as important, but I'd like to have some for rear passengers and to provide some fill. I have a couple of older MB Quart 5.25 speakers that are rated 50W which I can mount with an adapter. With a 50W amp, they should do nicely and would not take away from the front image.

I also have a custom subwoofer box with a 12 inch 100W, 8 ohm speaker that I want to reuse. I'd like to use a 4 channel amp that I could run one set of channels in tri-mode for the subwoofer. The only ones I could find were Boss Chaos 600 (75W x 4, 200Wx2) and Power Acoustiks OV4-800 (85Wx4, 210Wx2). I'd have to turn down the channel inputs for the Quart speakers to protect them. I saw that the Kicker KX 350.4 puts out 60Wx2 plus a 175W sub output but is more pricey. I'd appreciate any guidance here as well.

About the tweeters -- Honda has tweeter grills installed in the dash that I'd like to use, but I've read that the Kappa tweeters are on-axis and should be closer to the speakers. What's the impact of placing them on the dash -- will it be that bad?

Thanks.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Joe718

Post Number: 81
Registered: May-04
from the installs that I have doneusing line inputs are not a good idea, you usually run into alot of ground noise, i would look into a new radio, i was in like you i have a 96 ford taures where my radio was housed with my AC. Check out this link to find a instillation kit for your car http://www.scosche.com/scosche/installation/honda.asp With an aftermarket radio you will have a clean preamp signal
 

New member
Username: Andrewb

Post Number: 2
Registered: Aug-04
Thanks Joseph. Yeah, I've seen the accord dash plates for sale around $175. I want to avoid buying it and a head unit if possible; I have a limited budget. I'll try it with the existing head unit and if that doesn't work, I'll upgrade. All won't be lost - the amps I was looking at can handle line or RCA inputs.

Any thoughts on the amps or tweeter position?
 

Bronze Member
Username: Joe718

Post Number: 83
Registered: May-04
from the amps listed i think the power acoustics would suit you best, it would power your whole system, i saw it on etronics.com for $99, its true that when tweeters dont sound good away from the woofer, if you could find some cheap kick panels that would be nice or if you cold mount a the tweeter in that lil space between the door anf te dash that would sound nice just angle it towards the driver seat.
 

New member
Username: Andrewb

Post Number: 3
Registered: Aug-04
Thanks. I'll look into those door locations for the tweeters.
 

Gold Member
Username: Jonathan_f

GA USA

Post Number: 1207
Registered: May-04
That Power Acoustik is a poorly built, unreliable amp, as well as overrated, that's why it's so cheap. I'd do the JBL for best price/performance. You can run the factory head unit and simply upgrade later. You wouldn't really need an amp for the rear speakers, I'd just keep the stock ones back there since they're not that important. You can do the MB quarts and a 50Wx2 amp, but you'll never use that amp to it's full potential. You also could run the Quarts off the head unit, but you'll have to be careful not to drive the head unit into clipping.
 

New member
Username: Andrewb

Post Number: 4
Registered: Aug-04
I went on ebay and after looking at some prices for brand new components, I'm now considering getting both Kicker amps.
 

New member
Username: An_eagalach

Annandale, VA US

Post Number: 1
Registered: Aug-04
Andrew, I just bought the Honda Accord LX. At first I too was wondering what to do with those top of the dash tweeter spots. You should consider doing what I did -- get the CDT Audio TW-25SLP, an image enhancement tweeter, they are stand alone and are made specifically to be mounted on the dash and fire up into the windshield. I have yet to hear them (am going crazy and installing an entire new system into the car probably next week, I actually bought the dash replacement piece for an aftermarket head unit from Metra, Scosche doesn't make it), but from reviews they do wonders for system imaging. Go to http://www.thezeb.com, a pair of the tweeters retails for $150, on sale there for $60.
 

New member
Username: Andrewb

Post Number: 5
Registered: Aug-04
Neil,

Are you using component speakers up front and swapping the component tweeter with the TW-25SLP? What speakers are you using up front?

Let me know how they work out.
 

Gold Member
Username: Jonathan_f

GA USA

Post Number: 1233
Registered: May-04
Those CDT upstage kits (or the image enhancement kits for that matter) are made to be used as a supertweeter, meaning you'll need a component system PLUS that image enhancement kit. Put the tweeter from the Kappa 60.5 close to the woofer, and if you wish to use the upstage kit, install it in the factory location in the dash. That'd sound very nice, I've heard the CDT kits and it really does raise the soundstage quite well, while still allowing the tweeter from the component system to blend in with the mid.
 

New member
Username: Andrewb

Post Number: 6
Registered: Aug-04
Cool. I'll look into the CDT kit as well. Thanks for the ideas.
 

New member
Username: An_eagalach

Annandale, VA US

Post Number: 2
Registered: Aug-04
Andrew,

Here's my setup:

SPEAKERS: 1) in the front doors = Boston Acoustics 6.5's (6.5" mid/woofer + 1" tweeter); 2) in the kick panels = Focal 165K's (6.5" mid/woofer + 1" tweeter) with aftermarket molding mods; 3) 1" CDT imaging tweeters on the top of the dash; 4) rear deck = Focal 165HC 6.5" integrated, also Boston Acoustics stand alone tweeters that I bought years ago and can't part with, the imaging they add is breathtaking; 5) in the trunk 2 10-inch CDT subwoofers in custom boxes.

AMPS: 1) PPI 80 watts x 4 to run the Focal & BA floor-door speakers and the Focal rear deck speakers; 2) US Acoustics 50 watts x 4 to drive the Focal imaging tweeters and the BA rear tweeters; 3) US Acoustics 150 watts x 2 to drive the subs (they are super-efficient and only require 150 watts nominal).

HEAD UNIT: Clarion DXZ745MP CD-receiver with separate satellite radio receiver

EQUALIZER: Audio Control EQ line driver

CAPACITORS: 1 farad Lightning Audio + .5 farad Lightning Audio. Honda alternators are notoriously wimpy

Budget is definitely an issue with me. I hunt for Internet bargains with a vengeance. It took me two years to put all these pieces together, but averaging things out, I probably paid about 60% of retail for the whole package.

Things are kind of on hold for a week or so, I decided to Dynamat as much of the car as I can get to. No experience with sound dampeners myself, but people I've talked to say it makes a world of difference. I found some Dynamat for an excellent price, but shipping takes 7 days. But, I've waited this long, so...

Like Jonathan says, for component speakers, definitely mount the matching tweeter close to the woofer. If you get the CDT imagers, they are made for the dash near the windshield so positioning relative to other speakers is irrelevant. Another important thing to keep in mind is the cabling -- DON'T cut corners on the power, signal and speaker wires, quality makes a big difference in the final sound.

Keep us posted on how your system progresses. I'll do the same.
 

New member
Username: An_eagalach

Annandale, VA US

Post Number: 4
Registered: Aug-04
One more thing --

If you're still looking for amps, http://www.sonicelectronix.com has the Hifonics Zeus series on sale. For example, the ZX4000 with 100 watts x 2 into 4 ohms, MSRP is around $350, on sale here for $140. I've never heard any bad comments about Hifonics, maybe somebody else here in the forum has some experience with them.
 

New member
Username: Andrewb

Post Number: 7
Registered: Aug-04
Wow. I'm not nearly as ambitious. But the amps and speakers will still make the sound 1000% better. I ordered the CDT imagers as well.

I'm pretty happy with how quiet it is in the car while driving. Then again, I'm still comparing it to my old accord which I drove for 12 years. Sometimes, a little focused effort can have a big impact. With that said, what would you say would be the key area you would want to apply the dynamat (in cases I decide to do that down the road).

Yeah, I plan on running power and replacing the speaker wires. The accord uses 22AWG AWG wire for the speakers. What - they couldn't run at lease 18 or 16 AWG? How pitiful! And they probably only saved 10 cents per car. I didn't consider the ZX4000 amp since it doesn't have line inputs. I'm going to hang on to the stock head unit for now - I can only afford so much at a time. Thanks.
 

New member
Username: An_eagalach

Annandale, VA US

Post Number: 6
Registered: Aug-04
I thought my new Accord was fairly quiet too, until I got it out onto the interstate and was amazed at all the road noise that made it into the car. And the occasional long road trip at higher speeds is exactly why I want the upgrade anyway -- just adjust the seat back, throw on some good tunes, crank it up, and let the hours fly by... My previous car was a 1991 Civic (retired it with 200,000 miles) and it was really noisy, so when I first got my new Accord it was heaven. Now I'm just going for that extra margin of quiet.

For the Dynamat, the trunk gets complete coverage, and definitely the front doors. The ideal would be floors and roof as well, but I don't think I want to rip up the carpeting -- sound dampeners need to adhere to metal. I found a site that sells Dynamat Xtreme 36 sq ft for $100, I bought 2 packs so I'll have plenty in case I want to do the whole car, or put double layers on the trunk and doors. A good application of sound dampening material keeps road noise out, and your music in: I hate it when somebody pulls up next to you at a stoplight and you can hear, and feel the bass of, their music, even with your windows up and your stereo on. I'll keep my sounds to myself.

I swear by 16 awg speaker wires. A few years ago an electrical engineer friend of mine told me that extra thick wire shouldn't make that big of a difference, until we did a comparison switch on my car -- he changed his mind.

You're doing precisely what I did, just upgrading a little at a time, I definitely could not have afforded to plunk down everything I have spent over the last couple of years all at once. But you sound just like me when it comes to what you want and expect out of your car stereo, so you'll get to the point where you'll want to replace your head unit, and then better amp(s). In your system, the stock head unit will be the weak link. Keep Metra in mind for the dash radio/AC piece. They even make a replacement piece for that little cubbyhole with a door below the radio/AC so you can put other equipment (EQ, etc.) there. Ambition, research and patience will pay off.
 

Unregistered guest
hey guys.. i just bought a new accord as well but mine is the ex with dual zone climate controls.. anyone know of a kit out there to fix this dilema?? rockin stock sucks..
 

New member
Username: An_eagalach

Annandale, VA US

Post Number: 7
Registered: Aug-04
The terrible price you pay for having a sunroof :-)

Metra makes the replacement piece for the LX, so they probably do for the EX as well. The website is http://www.metraonline.com, but their website is not up-to-date, so you're better off calling them at 1 (800) 221-0932. You can find out if they make the thing. Then to buy -- http://www.thezeb.com is an authorized Internet dealer, but there are others.
 

Unregistered guest
Dear all, I also have accord 2004. What is actually the factory size of the front speaker? Isn't it 5 1/4"? Will 6 1/2" fit to the front?

thanks.
 

New member
Username: Andrewb

Post Number: 8
Registered: Aug-04
I should be getting my 6.5 inch component Kappas next week and will work on them then. I'll let you know how that goes.
 

Unregistered guest
the factory size is 6.5 not 5 1/4 i had two trusted car stereo equip dealers research it for me today and they do not have a kit yet maybe if enough people like us show interest they will produce it... i have decided to upgrade the speakers and add subs using two jl audio amps one 500.1 and the 300.4 and a 10 w7 in the jl enclosure. my installer assured me he can minimize any noise and maximize sq using some high end line inputs.. like 40 bucks each instead of 10 bucks for the cheesy ones.. well see how it goes.. i first have to decide between the mb quart premium components or the jl audio xr's.. i cant make up my mind and there seems to be plenty of supporters of both brands..
 

New member
Username: Hebat

San Gabriel, CA USA

Post Number: 5
Registered: Aug-04
6.5inch infinity will not fit. I have 2003 accord also. I use kicker r5c. you could check the size on cructhfield.com.
 

New member
Username: Andrewb

Post Number: 9
Registered: Aug-04
I'll probably have to cut the width of the door hole a bit larger, but the depth should be fine. I temporarily placed my 5 1/4 MB quarts up front using a 1/4 inch thick plexiglass spacer/mount I cut out. That gives plenty of room for the window and no mods required to the door panel (other than mounting the tweeters). The Kappas have the same depth. I'll let you know how it works out.
 

Bronze Member
Username: An_eagalach

Annandale, VA US

Post Number: 14
Registered: Aug-04
Andrew, I hope you're still around and checking out this forum.

I saw above that you ordered the CDT TW 25SLP image enhancers. These are 1" tweeters, or supertweeters, and are better than the .75" model. They have an attenuator, but do not have a crossover, which you will need so that the full range of frequencies don't get fed into them. I noticed today on thezeb.com that the CDT M-519S is on sale for $99 (they are regularly $249). The M-519S is part of their Stage Front UpStage System, and has a very nice crossover that can be used to tweak the tweeters to perfection. The tweeters are .75" and are inferior to the TW 25SLP, so... I'm buying the M-519S, then I'll use the crossovers with the TW 25SLP's. The results should be a thing of wonder. You can check out the writeup of the M-519S, with outside reviews, on the CDT homepage at http://www.cdtaudio.com/stagefront_upstage_systems.htm

This is a good option for you, especially if you install the TW 25SLP's and aren't quite satisfied with the sound. If you're like me, as budget permits, you'll be upgrading different components of your system.
 

New member
Username: Andrewb

Post Number: 10
Registered: Aug-04
Neil,

I'm using the Kappa crossover for now and the CDT tweeters are adding a lot of front image. I'll keep the other crossover in mind in the future if I decide I need it.

Well, I've completed phase 1 of the stereo installation. Installing the front 6.5 component Infinity Kappas required some minor modification. I had to cut the door speaker hole about a half inch larger, which was easy enough with a pair of tin snips. I used the spacer ring that comes with the Kappas which leaves enough room between the magnet and window. I surface mounted the tweeter just above the woofer. No mods to the external panels required.

The most complicated thing with the front speakers was passing through new wiring. No way was I going to use the existing 20.5 AWG wire. Unfortunately, the cable harness between the doors is connectorized and I didn't want to chance messing it up and loosing the door power controls. So I had to drill and run a separate cable to the door. Used some sleeving and bushings and it came out fine.

Initially, the Kappa speakers sounded -- okay. But I read about the break-in period and I have to say, their sound is changing. I'll give it a couple of weeks and then will play around with fine adjustments.

I installed the CDT tweeters in the dash panels and that came out nice. I installed my older MB Quart speakers in the rear and disconnected their tweeters to keep the image up front. Subwoofer is adding just enough bass for me.

Now for my one problem -- alternator noise. Here I could use some help from the veterans:

I installed the Kicker amps in the rear and grounded them really well. I also re-grounded the existing head unit, separated signal/power lines, etc. I'm using speaker line inputs to the amplifier. Start the car and I get a small amount of alternator whine that you can hear between CD tracks. Changing the volume on the head unit does not change the amount of alternator whine. Initially I thought I had an amplifier ground problem. However, when I disconnect the speaker line inputs, the noise disappears. Connecting a speaker directly to the line inputs plays clean music. I hooked up a portable CD player to the amps and they played clean music. But connect the head unit to the amps -- alternator whine. Any suggestions (besides a new head unit -- I can't afford that right now)? I was thinking of a pre-amp to convert/isolate to RCA inputs (need a 4 channel unit). Any recommendations? I'm going to do a couple of searches for more ideas.

Thanks,

Andrew
 

Silver Member
Username: Jayj

Louisiana USA

Post Number: 496
Registered: May-04
I know you said you don't have the cash now but you will have to upgrade that stock HU Those line inputs always do that crap.
 

Bronze Member
Username: Andrewb

Post Number: 11
Registered: Aug-04
I came across a PAC OEM2 line output converter on the internet that will convert my four speaker level inputs to RCA, as well as isolate the inputs and output circuits. Sounds like it may be the solution for now. Does anyone have any experience with these? Any other options?
 

Bronze Member
Username: An_eagalach

Annandale, VA US

Post Number: 17
Registered: Aug-04
Hi, Andrew

The line output converter sounds like it might suit your needs for now, but eventually you're going to have to upgrade that stock head unit -- weak link in the chain and all that.

You're much more adventurous in making physical mods to your car. I feel comfortable about doing wiring, grounding amps, etc., but making holes in the car is intimidating.

As far as alternator whine in my experience: in my old car stereo, I had good, triple-shielded signal cables with my main speakers and tweeters. Things sounded perfect. Then, when I installed a sub I used cheaper signal cables, thinking it wouldn't make any difference. The alternator whine was intolerable. When I disconnected the sub, the whine disappeared. The amp was well grounded, so I tended to blame the cable, that seemed to be the only thing different in the setup. After that, I never did get better cables to see if that would solve my problem, I decided I could live without subs for the time being. I don't know if this might help you or not -- getting a $25 cable would certainly be a cheap solution.

It's encouraging to hear that the CDT supertweeters are making a nice contribution to overall sound. Next Tuesday I have an appointment with professionals to do the installation on everything. I'll let you know how things turn out.
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