HO alt... battery problems???

 

Silver Member
Username: Djbeanpole

Naptown, Indiana USA

Post Number: 268
Registered: Nov-05
My uncle is a mechanic/car dealer in the Boston area so I sent him an email about my problem asking him what I should do... I'll give you a little excerpt of what I sent him so I can save myself some typing:

"The Toyota Camry I bought has been a great car so far and besides a few cosmetic problems I can't really complain. I'm not sure if you remember me explaining to you the whole "sound system" thing I had going on in my trunk or not... but basically it has an amplifier bolted down in the trunk that sucks up a huge amount of energy from my car. In order to keep this power-hungry amplifier juiced up, I order and installed a high output alternator that changed my wattage from stock alternator of 80amps to 180amps. It's been in the car for about 2 months and everything is working fine. However just recently when I was leaving work one day my car dashboard display had a battery icon flashing on and off and my idling RPMs (which are usually around 900) were jumping from 400 - 1200 and the engine sounded like it was coughing. I didn't think anything of it and left the hospital where I work and while the car was in drive as I was sitting at a light the battery icon came on again and the car died. When I started it back up it seemed to be working fine. Again this morning I was waiting for my mom at a coffee shop sitting in park with the car on (weather just got alot colder here so I was keeping the heat on), and I noticed the battery icon flashing again. I just turned the car off and waited for my mom, and when we left I turned the car on and it was fine.

Is my battery dying... or is there a problem with the alternator not charging the battery? My car has never done this before and I'm thinking either it's dying or there is something wrong with it getting charged. I was informed that part of an alternator's job is to keep the battery charged.

Just wondering if you had any insight as to what I should do?"
-----------------

After some recommendations from people on this forum, I purchased a 180amp alternator from Nate at excessiveamperage and finally got it placed in my car. It has been working fine (as far as I can tell). My girlfriend's dad put it in there for me because I did not have the right tools at my house to do it myself... that and he knew quite alot about cars (just retired from working at GM for like 30 years).

I'm assuming its a battery on the brink of dying (I'm not sure the battery has EVER been changed on the car), or there is a charging problem and some lead isn't connected properly to the battery (but why would it take about a month for the battery to start crapping out?) The HO alt kicks on at about 900-1500RPM, and I can defintely tell this ESPECIALLY when driving at night. If the car is in neutral, or I'm at a light, the dashboard lights are still illuminated but they are somewhat dim. When I press the gas and the RPMs go beyond 1500 the lights get really bright, including my headlights, etc. Even the windshield wipers wipe faster and when windows roll up and down faster if the RPMs are well above the 1500 range. If not, everything goes slower. That's normal, right?

The BIG 3 HAVE NOT been upgraded. The wiring is still whatever the old alternator was using (probably 16 gauge is my guess).

Any insight here would be great... trying to get some opinions before I take this to a mechanic (or to my g/f's dad first).

Thanks,

Dave
 

Gold Member
Username: Adddisorder

West palm, Florida

Post Number: 1192
Registered: Jan-06
UPGRADE BIG 3 IN 1/O GUAGE!

the current cant get to the battery fast enough becasue the wire is choking it, and your amp is robbing all of the batterys power destroying the cells.
 

Silver Member
Username: Djbeanpole

Naptown, Indiana USA

Post Number: 273
Registered: Nov-05
Alright so to add to this...

#1 - Is it NORMAL for the dashboard lights/headlights to get BRIGHTER as the RPMs increase. I thought they would stay at a constant brightness (as they did w/ the old alternator).
-----------------------------------------------
My car has officially died. It killed itself last night parked outside of my g/f's house. I hadn't been there for more than an hour and as I went outside to leave I turned the ignition and NOTHING. No click noises, nada. Her dad came out and tried to jump my car with his car, although when the leads were hooked up my dome light/dashboard/headlights worked the car still wouldn't turn. So he got out a battery charger and it said my battery was FINE. Tried turning it then and nothing besides a huge spark that popped off from the battery charger leads.

Ok so... weird. Oddly enough (and DUMB), my subs stopped working a few days ago because the amplifier wasn't getting power. I never figured to check the POWER CABLE (was too preoccupied looking at fuses), but noticed the power cable from Battery ---> Fuse was no longer in the fuse and had fallen out. Ok great, so thats why the amp wasn't getting power... could that be why the battery was acting strange? All that power trying to travel into the wire and nowhere to go? Could the wire have grounded itself to the car metal in the engine and shorted something out?

I dunno... I had AAA tow it to my mechanic and he said he'll look at it later down the week...

I don't think it's a battery problem. Because when I get in my car the dome light comes on and if I turn the key to turn on the electrical power it works (car makes a "your keys are still in the ignition" ringing noise). But when I try to turn the ignition it doesn't do anything.

Mat dope's suggesting has been taken under advisement and depending on what the mechanics discover I will be upgrading the Big 3. My gf's dad thinks a fuse somewhere has blown, the AAA guy thinks the ECM is messed up, I have no idea, and the mechanic said he wouldn't know until he gets under the hood.

Oh AND my radiator is leaking. AWESOME.

So... I'll see whats up and let you guys know just in case someone is suffering the same symptoms. Anyone have their own personal ideas as to what the culprit could be?

Thanks,
Dave
 

Silver Member
Username: Th3pwn3r

Chicago, Illinois U.S.A

Post Number: 643
Registered: Jul-06
Neutral safety switch?Starter?Maybe you shorted out your ecu somehow?There are a number of things that could be wrong.It's hard to pinpoint things some times,you just have to keep testing things piece by piece I guess.Try jump starting your starter and see if it still works,that's a quick process just to rule the starter out.
 

Silver Member
Username: Th3pwn3r

Chicago, Illinois U.S.A

Post Number: 645
Registered: Jul-06
I just entirely read what you posted and I've heard of people having problems with Excessive Amperage alternators...I hope this isn't the problem but I reccomend you taking the alternator out and taking it to a local Auto parts store and have it tested.What kind of battery(s) were you running by the way?
 

Silver Member
Username: Djbeanpole

Naptown, Indiana USA

Post Number: 277
Registered: Nov-05
Rob I will be able to answer your question about the battery when I finally hear about my car, or when I go back to the mechanic's lot to look under my hood again. I hadn't had ANY problems at all with the stock alternator except that when loud bass notes would hit, the lights would dim. It didn't bother me that much but I wanted to make sure my amplifier was getting an efficient amount of power. Once I put on the new alternator (from excessiveamperage), the car started fine. The belts turned, etc... the only difference I noted between having the two alternators was this:

OLD ALTERNATOR (80Amp): Interior lights/dashboard lights/headlights/power windows stayed at a constant brightness, and the windows moved at a constant speed up/down... DOWNSIDES: dimming lights when lots of bass.

NEW ALTERNATOR (180Amp) [again to note, not upgrade to Big 3 yet]: Dimming still occurs slightly when the music is really loud, or I'm sitting at a light/stuck in traffic... which is FINE because I read that HO Alts will not completely eliminate dimming. No alternator whine, "healthier" and longer life for other electrical components... DOWNSIDES: Interior lights/dashboard lights/headlights/power windows seem to have a slight dim to them when at an idle RPM or when car is at a light/stuck in traffic. When pushing on gas to move RPMs past a certain point (~1200) all lights brighten. Power windows move slowly at idle/stuck in traffic unless I push on gas which makes them go faster.

I'm thinking that the whole "dim lights unless RPMs is up" is a problem. Shouldn't they be at a constant brightness... ???

Thats what I have for now. Hoping to hear from mechanic today!!! Will update later.

Thanks for input from everyone so far.
 

Silver Member
Username: Djbeanpole

Naptown, Indiana USA

Post Number: 278
Registered: Nov-05
*UPDATE*
Ok so I just got off the phone w/ my mechanic... turns out there were some bad power connections that were not allowing the car to start. Glad to know it wasn't something complicated like the starter... and the radiator had to be replaced. No big deal.

I asked him about the wiring of the alternator and he said it was 4gauge. I asked him about whether the dim lighting at idle then brighter as RPMs increased was normal and he said yes. I wanted him to elaborate more, but perhaps he will go into more detail when I go in to pick the car up.... anyway thats the problem. I thought it was a big thing but it turned out to be a little thing.

Still worth going from 4g to 1/0g?
 

Gold Member
Username: Basshead86

Try Google

Post Number: 7322
Registered: Aug-05
my lights still dim and i have a 220a Alt. lol

but they don't dim above 1100rpms.:-)

and yes, my dash lights and even headlght and everything in my cargets brighter from idle to higher rpms...:-O
 

Silver Member
Username: Djbeanpole

Naptown, Indiana USA

Post Number: 279
Registered: Nov-05
Muddy thats good to know I thought something was wrong.

But is it normal for the lights to be doing that when my stereo is OFF?
 

Gold Member
Username: Basshead86

Try Google

Post Number: 7328
Registered: Aug-05
yes, b/c the alt puts out more power with a higher engine rpm regardless of what needs to be powered by it.

at idle it doesn't do as much Voltage, but when you increase the RPM's the Voltage increases, hence the brighter lights!
 

Silver Member
Username: Djbeanpole

Naptown, Indiana USA

Post Number: 280
Registered: Nov-05
Muddy you are taking away my worries one post at time! Do you think it would still be a good idea to upgrade to 1/0 from 4 gauge wiring?

And what could cause the power wire to fall out of the fuse? Because right now the fuse/powerwire is looped through various parts of the engine and then eventually through the firewall (I'll take a picture sometime to explain this better). Is there anything I can do to ensure it won't happen again (I already tried tightening where the power wire enters into the fuse as tight as I could)?

Muddy, you da man!
 

Gold Member
Username: Basshead86

Try Google

Post Number: 7329
Registered: Aug-05
haha your welcome! :-)

i dont see how it will hurt it, my 220a is on 4ga. and i don't haveany problems...the wire doesn't get any hotter than the everything else in the engine bay. lol but i am not using all 220a. sooooo

there is something you can use...to connect the power wire to the fuse holder, has rubber ends and a metal ring...forget the name(typers block) lol
 

Gold Member
Username: Basshead86

Try Google

Post Number: 7330
Registered: Aug-05
get an ANL fuse (and holder) if oyu don't already have one and some RING TERMINALS!!! hahaha i remembered..

Upload

bigger than those of course.:-)
 

Silver Member
Username: Djbeanpole

Naptown, Indiana USA

Post Number: 281
Registered: Nov-05
Hey Muddy, I was doing some reading on those things (and came across a very detailed "how to install a system yourself" guide...dammit i could have saved some $ by doing it myself!)

Uh anyway... I have a ring terminal on the battery which is connected to the power wire... and from there the power wire enters the fuse holder. I will have to upload pictures to show you this. For my fuse holder, from what I can remember, the fuse was covered in a plastic case (the holder). Where the power wires went into and left from had some screw-like apparatus that was used to push against the power wire to hold it in place. THAT was what I was wondering about. Is there any way to keep that power wire in the fuse holder besides just tighening the screw that holds it in place. Because the wire that went from Battery -> Fuse had fallen out. And that is not good. According to this guide:

"Fuses are vital. If a wire breaks and comes in contact with metal, it will blow the fuse. If the fuse is not there, the wire will either catch on fire or melt due to the massive current flowing through it when it shorts, or the battery will boil and explode. These are bad things."

Well no *@#^. I wanna keep that power wire in there, dammit. I don't think ring terminals are used to connect into the fuse holder... unless I'm mistaken?
 

Silver Member
Username: Djbeanpole

Naptown, Indiana USA

Post Number: 283
Registered: Nov-05
Oh and just to elaborate because i never said this in the beginning of the post:

1999 Toyota Camry
*Unsure of type battery/how long its been in there
Kicker KX1200.1, came w/ 150fuse and holder
2 12" Alpine Type-R's (1242D I think)
180A HO Alt from excessiveamperage
1/0gauge wire for power wire
4gauge wire for big 3

There!
 

Gold Member
Username: Basshead86

Try Google

Post Number: 7344
Registered: Aug-05
i have been told every 4 years you should replace your battery(if it is the stock one, aftermarket batts last a while longer depending on make and model)


my fuse holder has a nut and bolt to mount the fuse/power wire in it. with a lock washer and then washer to keep anything from moving and get a good press on the wire...
 

Silver Member
Username: Djbeanpole

Naptown, Indiana USA

Post Number: 284
Registered: Nov-05
*UPDATE*

So I got my car back now and it works. The subs are working again (figured they would since the power wire is back in the fuse). When I get time towards the end of the week I am upgrading the BIG 3, gonna see what I can do about getting the power wire to stay snugly in place, and get me a damn car wash its dirty as hell!

Decided to not start blasting my subs seeing as how they have been silently sleeping for the past week in 30-40 degree weather... wanted to warm them up a bit, but yes... they are alive again. :D

Thanks all!
 

Gold Member
Username: Basshead86

Try Google

Post Number: 7592
Registered: Aug-05
good to hear!:-)
 

Silver Member
Username: Djbeanpole

Naptown, Indiana USA

Post Number: 285
Registered: Nov-05
The only downside is the mechanic, who I told to not fix a broken window regulator, decided to use duct tape to hold the window in place (its a long story as to how it broke)... so now whenever I decided to take the tape off it may end up pulling the tint off with it... great :-(
 

Gold Member
Username: Basshead86

Try Google

Post Number: 7596
Registered: Aug-05
most mechanics are smart with cars....and that is IT
 

Silver Member
Username: Djbeanpole

Naptown, Indiana USA

Post Number: 286
Registered: Nov-05
And then again last night as I was on my way out to dinner my check engine light comes back on... LOL.

Taking it back to him tonight to see what the code is for the error. I think this car is trying to tell me something...
 

Gold Member
Username: Basshead86

Try Google

Post Number: 7632
Registered: Aug-05
what a PITA....
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